Very well said!  Three cheers to this man, and I raise my hat!

HP

At 05:10 AM 4/14/00 -0400, Jeffrey R wrote:
>A Plea For Civility for those who have gotten this far:
>
>We all know the pen is mightier than the sword. If that is true then this
>Internet community must be the equivalent of a nuclear reaction. That kind of
>power needs to be handled responsibly.
>
>While I am sure no one in this community sets out to insult and embarrass
>others in this community that sometimes is unfortunately the result. And
>because of the reach of the list those insults become global.
>
>Unfortunately we are in a world that does very little business face to face
>anymore. This means we all need to work harder at understanding the person on
>the other end of the phone in a human being, and are entitled to be treated
>fairly. And further that each member of this list, whether vendor or hobbyist
>is also a person.
>
>I am sure none of us wake up in the morning and think "Today I shall insult,
>humiliate, and embarrass to the best of my ability." And certainly we would
>not get to work and face to face insult, humiliate, and embarrass those we
>work with. What kind of world would that be? Why would we want to live in it?
>
>But without face to face contact the line between acceptable behavior and
>unacceptable behavior can get blurred. We start to think of the voice on the
>other end of the phone as at best a means to an end or even a nuisance or an
>obstacle.
>
>What I want to point out is that while the computer screen is an inanimate
>object the listmembers it represents are not. We are, each of us,
>individuals--yes even the vendors. And we each have a responsibility to
>respect that.
>
>In addition we have a responsibility as publishers. We each publish every
>word we submit to the list and reach about 800 readers. This means our words
>are in a public forum.
>
>I'm sure in this most recent flare up of vendor flaming those who spoke out
>about what they see as unpleasant experiences dealing with the Bus Depot
>would not even think of renting a billboard to insult and embarrass Ron, they
>would not get behind a bullhorn and scream public insults as he walked from
>the grocery store, they would not hand out leaflets insulting him and his
>business, because they would be bullies. And while it's not as easy to see
>when we are writing from our homes onto this electronic screen it is very
>easy to become an Internet bully.
>
>Why a bully? Because a bully ultimately tries to humiliate. To tease one
>publicly about a shortcoming is the behavior of a bully. I'm sure all of us
>would resent getting pulled to the front of an auditorium full of coworkers
>and friends and be told of our shortcomings. This would be humiliating. This
>would be bullying. And it really serves little purpose except to make the
>bully feel good about putting someone else down.
>
>I could go on, but I think it is easy to see that mentioning a specific
>vendor and then take it as far as to mention a specific employee in front of
>800 people is bullying behavior. I should mention it's easy to see in
>hindsight. My guess is those who spoke ill of Ron did not realize the power
>they have as a member of the list.
>
>For my money we should all refrain from blasting a vendor or a fellow listee
>until such time as it becomes irresponsible not to let others know. That
>meaning the normal methods of reconciliation of a problem cannot be solved
>through a phone call or two or a letter. And we list members should be
>alerted at the same time as the Better Business Bureau and of something
>worthy of their time and ours. "I called and the guy was unhelpful," seems
>like something that should be brought up privately with Ron or the particular
>vendor. We have to ask ourselves a question before we send a negative post:
>Do I need to talk to the vendor or do I need to TELL THE WORLD?
>
>And, yes, the vendors in some way get free "advertising" in the same way we
>all do. And VW gets free advertising on your grill. And Michelin gets free
>advertising on your sidewalls. And Nike gets free advertising on your shoes.
>But none of that excuses us from acting as decent respectful human beings.
>
>And to address the issue of always posting bad experiences with a vendor--I'd
>say sure, do that. But also post every positive interaction. In short post
>every interaction. But do it on a newly created "Vanagon Commerce List". I'll
>check it when I'm using a vendor for the first time. It works pretty well on
>eBay--rating scale and all. In the meantime I'll use the vendors I've been
>dealing with, Ron and Ken and yes, VWOA.
>
>Since it was Ron who was hung in effigy here, lemme say "give the guy a
>break." He's started a mom and pop on the edge of the 21st century. He's up
>against giants--NAPA, VWOA  and the world, Pep Boys (there is no Manny, Mo,
>or Jack) RS Strauss, and so on. And he offers discounts through the mail
>while doing business over the phone. (have you ever had a job answering
>phones? It's unnatural.) It's not your neighborhood parts store. They've been
>forced out of business by the big chains and by us. This is the world we
>created. I don't like it, but I'm just as guilty as you. Wal Mart has a lot
>of stuff cheap. And I shop there. And I hate parts of myself for it. But you
>and I created it and have let it blossom. It seems a bit unfair to blame Ron.
>
>Yes, this is the 21st century. We can pay for gas at the pump. We can't talk
>to the branch of the bank in our neighborhood only to the 800 number operator
>at a computer terminal two states away. We can by our movie tickets and train
>tickets from vending machines and over the Internet. We can pay
>electronically at toll booths and toll clerks will soon be gone (no more toll
>house cookies!). We don't even have to speak to operators on the phone "Press
>one for problems, Press two for new orders, Press three for old orders, Press
>three for two, Press two for one, Press..." We may never have to see another
>human being ever. But until that time comes let's treat each other with
>respect.
>
>We drive Vanagons. We're not like them. Are we?
>
>To all here I say congratulations on having the power of being a list member.
>It is the kind of power unheard of in recorded history. Please use it wisely
>and respectfully.
>
>As far as changing the world: I work two jobs, I'm a little busy right now.
>But I wish you'd do it.
>
>Your Pal
>Jeff
>1983.5 Westy
>NYC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>But that does not excuse any of us from being gentleman and gentlewomen
>whether we are making a call or answering one.