Rennie... I've had one loaf (76) and three vanagons.  I think the loaf was
better overall as everyone has expressed, but slippery conditions aside
(snow, ice, sand, etc), I think the two are fairly comparable just climbing
over things.  We do a lot of extremely uneven terrain here in Hawaii in the
lava fields and I never had any trouble with the vanagon or the loaf with
the exception of high centering them and having the drive wheel off the
ground.  Even then, a push to ground the drive wheel and I was on my way.
Now the slippery stuff is another story... ultimate solution except for
$$$... syncro.

Mick Kalber
Tropical Visions Video, Inc.
62 Halaulani Place    Hilo, Hawaii  96720
ph. 808-935-5557    fax 808-935-0066
hotlava@interpac.net
www.volcanoscapes.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM]On Behalf
Of Rennie Wible
Sent: Friday, August 04, 2000 6:25 PM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: Off-Road

The 'off-roading' I plan on doing is strictly in Baja.  There are quite
a few favorite surf spots that I frequent.  So far these have all been
made in my splitties.  Having just sold my (Baja worthy) splittie, I am
considering the journey in my vanagon.

The one '4wd' road that I always took in my bus is the main concern.  It
is only about an 1/8th of a mile but very uneven.  At one point, the bus
is leaning quite a bit on one side.  This is a very slow moving area,
even by splittie standards!

Anyone had similar experiences in a Vanagon?  I would love to take it on
the next trip, but the concensus from list is making me nervous!

Rennie
VolksDragon@earthlink.net
Los Angeles

61 crew cab
65 convertible
84 vanagon
93 fox

"Jon B. Kanas" wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> I add another vote to the camp who maintains that the Vanagon is simply
> not suitable for ANY off-roading unless it is a Syncro.  I had a 1971
> camper which was wonderful off-road;  I could take on most low to moderate
> difficulty 4WD trails in Colorado uneventfully.
>
> On the day I bought my first Vanagon (1983 Westfalia) I got it stuck
> during a very simple stream-fording off of Independence Pass.  This was a
> stream which I had crossed multiple times in the 1971, and once in Kim's
> 1974 Pontiac Ventura.  I attribute the problem to 1st gear being too high,
> more weight, and less-than-optimum weight distribution.
>
> The first snowy day was also an adventure in the Vanagon.  I eventually
> found that with very aggressive studded snow tires it was satisfactory in
> snow;  the 1971 was great in snow, even with street tires.  Overall the
> Vanagon camper has a better interior layout and is a much nicer vehicle
> than the early busses for daily use.  Is is, however, my opinion that an
> awful lot of utility use was given up in the interest of comfort and
> highway cruise capability.
>
> After driving the 1983 for 90K miles, I sold it and bought a 1987
> Westfalia Syncro specifically because of these problems.  The Syncro has
> been exceptional in the off-road and winter arenas, but the
> excessive costs associated with the Syncro-only parts is frustrating.
>
> Regards,
> Jon Kanas