Guys, let's skip the recycling discussion for a second and go back to my
original problem.  I have a muffler that looks, in my opinion, very dented.
The problem I have is that I need to get this van up and running by Friday
so I can take it with me on Christmas Holidays.  My posting was not to rant
about using recycling materials -vs- new but if I should return the muffler
or use it?

So what do you guys think?  Should I use the muffler or not?

Please also, before I receive another message suggesting that I am
destroying the world, please put my message in context.  I need to get my
van up and running for the Christmas holiday.  So three weeks before I
needed it, I ordered a muffler.  It ends up taking much longer to receive
then anticipated.  When I do receive it, arrives damaged.   So now I am mad
because I might need to cancel my plans (or at least re-arrange them).  From
my prospective, this would not have occurred if it was shipped properly.  I
have no problem with using recycled materials, as long as they protect the
item being shipped.

Also, please do not take this as a giant attack on Bus Depot.  As I said in
my original message, I love Bus Depot and have happily spent 1000's of
dollars with them.  But I do need to get my van up and running.

So, please if you thought my posting was an attack on the environment, or an
attack on Bus Depot, please accept apologies.  I just need to get my van up
and running and was looking for some advice.

Thanks,

Paul

----- Original Message -----
From: "The Bus Depot" <busdepot@EMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Very dented muffler AND Recycled Packing

> > I just received my brand-new muffler from Bus Depot.
> > The muffler now has a series of very large dents.
> > Should I send it back? Will the dents effect performance?
> > I love bus depot but why the hell can't they just purchase new
> > boxes?  Every time I order something it arrives in a beat-up old
> > box with wrapped newspaper instead of proper filler!  You can
> > purchase a new box at a manufacturer for under 75 cents!
>
>
> > The difference between appearance parts and performance parts
> > is in the eye of the buyer. I know guys who would take back a
> > starter for cosmetic reasons. If you want to return the dented
> > muffler it's your choice.
> > The small retailer can get away with reusing shipping/packing
> > materials because the costs saved are more than the costs spent in lack
> > of conformity (can you imagine GM or VW using old boxes for their
parts?)
> > The balance of costs saved and resulting lower prices is augmented by
> > the environmental impact of adding to the waste stream.  Unlike
newspaper
> > styrofoam shipping "peanuts" won't decay in months. In many other
cultures
> > our newspapers and "throwaway" boxes would spend second and third lives
> > before being discarded.  Reduce,recycle,reuse.
>
>
> In some ways Stephen answered this better than I could have.  Re-using
boxes
> and using shredded waste paper and newspaper for packing is a conscious
> decision based primarily on environmental concerns. Although make no
> mistake; it also saves you money.  On average, given the size/capacity of
> the boxes we'd need, buying new boxes/packing for each order would cost
> about $2-3 per order, which would directly be passed on to you.  But more
> importantly, we would be buying large volumes of brand new cardboard and
> packing, while at the same time throwing away perfectly good boxes and
> packing that our suppliers' shipments arrived in every morning.  The
amount
> of cardboard and paper waste that we would generate every single week
would
> nearly fill up a Vanagon - no exaggeration.   It would tug at my
conscience
> to do that.
>
> We do buy new boxes for some items now, notably bumpers and some other
large
> items, simply because it is too hard to find good used ones. But my wife's
> friend in Reading works at a business that throws out their extra boxes
and
> peanuts, and twice a week my wife brings them home (you can fit more boxes
> in a Beetle than you think!), plus periodically I drive up there (1-1/2
hrs
> round trip) and load my van full.  (This is certainly more time consuming
> than simply buying new boxes and "peanuts.")  The corner grocer saves me
his
> unsold Sunday papers, and once a month I pick them up to use for packing.
> And there are shredders located throughout the shop; waste paper (of which
> we generate much) becomes packing material rather than garbage. We ship
> 50-100 orders a day with a 6-8 person crew, yet our weekly garbage fits
into
> two medium sized garbage cans.  I feel good about that.
>
> It's worth noting that this sort of packing is not unusual in our
business.
> With one exception, _all_ of our wholesale suppliers ship our parts to us
in
> used boxes with bunched up newspaper as packing, just as we do. (Only
> Motorworks ships every single order in a brand new box and with brand new
> packing.)  So the method is tried and true. Of course, you can't control
> whether UPS drop-kicks the box in shipping, which seems to happen often.
You
> should see the condition of some of the Motorworks boxes I've received,
and
> I know for a fact that they were new when they left there. (When you get a
> box from us that looks beat, don't assume it left here that way. Be wary
of
> shipping damage that may result in a UPS claim; call us immediately and
save
> the box and packing if damage is discovered.)  So the order has to be
packed
> well regardless of the "age" of the packing material.  My employees get a
> weekly bonus for good performance, and each "packer" has to individually
> sign off on every box that he packs. If you complain about improper
packing
> or a missing part, the guy who packed your order has to pay about half of
> the re-shipping cost himself, right out of his bonus - so he has quite an
> incentive to do his job carefully.
>
> While most of our incoming shipments arrive packed in newspaper, exhaust
> shipments often arrive here quite differently.  We get fifty or a hundred
> mufflers at a time, all thrown into a big crate with no packing
whatsoever.
> By the time they reach us (or any retailer) they often have minor dents. I
> suppose that the manufacturers don't consider this very consequential, as
> the part has no cosmetic value and will probably be dented sitting
> underneath the van within a month anyway. It is my suspicion that this is
> where your muffler got dented, Paul.  If the dent is not causing any sort
of
> rip at a seam (and is not severe as in "crushed" rather than dented), then
> it will not affect performance and I would personally not worry about it.
> But if you are concerned, we would be happy to send a replacement out to
you
> today.
>
> I can't say that as we grow it may not be neccessary to increase the
amount
> of new boxes and packing that we use.  But it is a decision that I will
make
> with great reluctance and only as a last resort. Meanwhile I'll continue
to
> go out of my way to pick up unsold newspapers and discarded boxes from
other
> businesses in the community, and do my part to be part of the solution
> rather than part of the problem.
>
> - Ron Salmon
>   The Bus Depot, Inc.
>   www.busdepot.com
>   (215) 234-VWVW