Ron & List,

I have owned & driven 3 - 84's, 1 - 85, 2 86's, and a 91.  I have replaced
the engine in the 91 and can confirm that the clutch is a LUX.  I did not
replace the clutch & at 138,000 miles it is still fine.  I will reports that
it is a lot harder to push the pedal in than any of the other Vanagons I
have owned.  I don't know if it is a characteristic of the heavy duty clutch
or if it a quirk of my bus.

I do know that some of the  earlier buses did have clutch chatter.  I found
that if you beat the clutch a bit, it would improve.  You know, heat it up a
little, let it fly, let it slip a bit.

Walt Spak
Pittsburgh, PA.
wnsopc3@3rdm.net

----- Original Message -----
From: The Bus Depot <vanagon@BUSDEPOT.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2001 8:40 PM
Subject: Re: Different clutch kits

> > I need to replace my clutch and I noticed that Bus Depot has two
> > different kits.  One is the stock Sachs kit and the other is a premium
LUK
> > kit.  I was wondering if the LUK was worth the extra $70 and if anyone
> > knew what was better about it?
>
>
> Actually, I carry not two, but THREE different Vanagon clutch kits.
>
> The "entry-level" one, at around $114 with listmember discount, is the
basic
> Sachs kit, same as sold pretty much everywhere else under the sun. This is
> what the vast majority of Vanagons have on them now, and is what I have on
> my own Westy.  There have been some claims on this List in the past that
the
> Sachs kit can be prone to "clutch chatter."  In many cases, the cause
turned
> out to be unrelated, such as worn motor mounts, a flywheel that was not
> resurfaced, etc.  I have had not one iota of trouble with the Sachs kit on
> my own '89 Westy. On the other hand, I had the identical kit in my '85
> Vanagon a few ears earlier and it did chatter.  Worn mounts?  Uneven
> flywheel? Hot spot on the disk?  Who knows. Personally I'm not convinced
> that the Sachs kits have any real problem with clutch chatter that
couldn't
> be explained some other way, but some would disagree.  Maybe for some odd
> reason they're more susceptable to it, who knows.  Which is why I started
> carrying the LuK kits.  If you want to blame the Sachs kits as being more
> "chatter susceptable,"  or just "don't want to chance it," buy the LuK.
>
> The "middle" kit is the stock LuK kit, at $143 with discount.  This is
LuK's
> competition to the Sachs kit. (For any who are unaware, both Sachs and LuK
> are OE suppliers to VW, so they both have equal legitimacy, although Sachs
> has a better-known aftermarket name here in the US.)  I have not yet heard
> any reports of clutch chatter with the LuK kits at all.  (Of course there
is
> a far smaller installed user base of them, so it would follow that there
> would be vastly fewer complaints anyway.)  Certainly there is no downside
to
> the LuK kit as compared to the Sachs. So, best case, you get a more
reliable
> kit, and worst case, you wasted the extra $29. Not a lot of money
> considering the cost/hassle of the clutch job as a whole.
>
> The "high-end" kit is the heavy-duty LuK kit, which is $190 with discount.
> This kit has been erroneously referred to on the List as a "Syncro only"
> clutch kit.  In reality, it is the kit that VW switched to in mid 1989
(and
> used thru the end of Vanagon production in 1991) on both 2WD and Syncro
> models.  Neither LuK nor Sachs sell this kit in the U.S. anymore; instead
> they now "supercede" it to the earlier version (the two kits above). So I
> have to import this one directly from LuK in Germany.  As I understand it,
> the main improvements in the later style were a slightly stronger center
hub
> area, and a slight redesign that reduced the required travel of the clutch
> pedal.  This may be a nice benefit, as I must admit that I am guilty of
> sometimes failing to push the pedal all the way to the floor when
shifting;
> it does have quite a bit of travel with the original design.
>
> As I said, I have the Sachs kit in my Vanagon and have not had a problem
> with it.  That said, if I were going to do it again, I'd buy the $190 kit.
> (At the time I installed mine, I did not yet have the LuK kits available,
so
> there was no choice.)
>
> Why?  Well, a clutch job is a major pain-in-the-ass that I don't want to
go
> through often.  My line of thinking is that considering the small
difference
> in price (about $75 between the cheapest and best options),  weighed
against
> the cost of having to do the job again prematurely (or worse yet, losing
my
> clutch 300 miles from home), it's just money well spent. Replacing a part
> that takes half an hour to replace (and won't be dangerous if it fails)?
> Might as well try using the cheapest part because you have little to lose
> Replacing a part that will take half a day to replace again if it fails,
and
> might even leave you stranded?  Not worth cutting corners on that one.
With
> any big repair I think it's just good insurance to use the best quality
> parts possible.  At the absolute minimum I'd go the middle ground and get
> the $143 kit.
>
> But as I said, the vast majority of Vanagons have the cheaper Sachs kits
> (since almost nobody but me sells the LuK ones) and they work just fine.
And
> of course there's no saying that if you put in the most expensive part,
you
> still won't be the one in 1000 who gets a bad one. So in the end, as
always,
> it's your money and your decision.
>
> - Ron Salmon
>   The Bus Depot, Inc.
>   (215) 234-VWVW
>   www.busdepot.com
>
> _____________________________________________
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