I like it that way myself, makes it easier to follow a thread
if you haven't been tracking it from the start.

JT
82 Dieselfant II Threadbare

-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com]On Behalf
Of don spence
Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2003 1:18 PM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: pet peeve-edit your replys

Is it really necessary to include all the stuff below just to say

"My Projektwzo copies have the plastic caps, I just shot a can
> of Krown rustproofer inside, it will swish around as I drive.
> I'll probably do it once a season.
>
> Thanks,
> Chris"

Please folks, (Chris is not the only culprit) edit your replies. You
are gobbling up server/archive space, filling our inboxes and ISP's
servers  with useless unnecessary repetition and making an archive
search an arduous task . Please include only the reference necessary to
let us know what you are talking about.
nuff said.

On Saturday, December 6, 2003, at 10:42  AM, Automatic digest processor
wrote:

> Date:    Sat, 6 Dec 2003 10:32:02 -0500
> From:    80 Westy Pokey <pokey@VANAGON.ORG>
> Subject: Re: Vanagon Bush Guard /Bumpers
>
>
> ---- Original message ----
>> Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2003 18:21:31 -0600
>> From: Bruce Nadig <motorbruce@HOTMAIL.COM>
>> Subject: Re: Vanagon Bush Guard /Bumpers
>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>
>> Ken,
>>
>> Thanks for the comments and clarifications. I guess my
> biggest concern would
>> be the plastic caps on the ends. I'd worry about water
> making it into the
>> tubes and starting some rust. Sounds like a good product.
>>
>> The price drop is certainly a nice feature. I wish you
> success.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Bruce
>>
>>
>>
>>> From: Kenneth Wilford <kenwilfy@COMCAST.NET>
>>> Reply-To: Kenneth Wilford <kenwilfy@COMCAST.NET>
>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>> Subject: Re: Vanagon Bush Guard /Bumpers
>>> Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2003 18:01:56 -0500
>>>
>>> Good point.  About Pzwo caring, I am sure that would care
> about the use
>>> of their name if I was saying they were Pzwo bull bars and
> they weren't.
>>> The only reason I mention them is for comparison sake.
> They have
>>> discontinued selling these bull bar bumpers (it is my
> understanding that
>>> they didn't actually make them, just marketed and sold them
> under their
>>> name).  I could say, "Hey I have a set of bull bar bumpers
> for sale."
>>> and not mention Pzwo but mentioning them usually brings up
> the image of
>>> what they look like in a person's mind.  Anyway, the other
> bumpers that
>>> we sell are made in the US.  The three main differences
> that I know if
>>> between them and the original Projektzwo bull bar bumpers
> are:
>>> The Pzwo bumper had a very thin aluminum plate "step" on
> the top, these
>>> have nothing there.
>>> The Pzwo bumper had welded round metal caps on the ends of
> the pipes,
>>> these have plastic caps.
>>> The rear bumper on these has a 2" receiver hitch welded in,
> the Pzwo
>>> bumpers did not have this.
>>>
>>> These are the facts.  I guess I'll have to wait until one
> of my newer
>>> customers hits an Antelope to tell you for sure the US made
> ones are up
>>> to the same standard as the Projektwzo ones.
>>>
>>> PS did I mention the price was half.  This is mainly
> because of not
>>> having to pay tons of money for shipping from Germany.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Ken Wilford
>>> John 3:16
>>> http://www.vanagain.com
>>> http://www.strictlyvwauctions.com
>>> Phone: (856)-327-4936
>>> Fax: (856)-327-2242
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List
> [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
>>> Of Bruce Nadig
>>> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2003 5:14 PM
>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>> Subject: Re: Vanagon Bush Guard /Bumpers
>>>
>>>
>>> Ken,
>>>
>>> Have you checked your own web site recently? I just checked
> and it
>>> clearly says "Bulli Bar Bumper- Front-$1399 (Black, Powder
> Coated)
>>> Discontinued" and "Projektzwo Rear Bumper (Black, Powder
> Coated)-
>>> $899.00 (Discontinued)". Sure, it looks like you are
> offering an
>>> American made alternative, but is it made to the same
> standards (I'm NOT
>>> American bashing here!)? Two things can look the same, but
> be made to
>>> very different standards when you take into consideration
> type of steel,
>>> gauge, quality of the welds, etc.
>>>
>>> The reason I bring this up is that you specifically
> reference the
>>> Projektzwo name where you are trying to sell an imitation
> product. The
>>> Projektzwo folks probably wouldn't be too happy about this.
> I'll be the
>>> first to admit that the American made alternative you offer
> could be
>>> every bit as good, if not better, than the discontinued PZ
> units, but
>>> please try to be careful when representing your products.
>>>
>>> I think we have all had disappointing experiences with look
> alike
>>> products. Generic toilet paper just ain't the same as
> Charmin. Just
>>> because the PZ bull bar survived an antelope doesn't mean
> that your
>>> generic (which the American units basically are, who knows
> who is making
>>> these bumpers and to what standard?) bars will do the same.
>>>
>>> Just my two cents.
>>>
>>> Bruce
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> From: Kenneth Wilford <kenwilfy@COMCAST.NET>
>>>> Reply-To: Kenneth Wilford <kenwilfy@COMCAST.NET>
>>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>>> Subject: Re: Vanagon Bush Guard /Bumpers
>>>> Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2003 13:41:58 -0500
>>>>
>>>> If you look on our website on the accessories page you
> will see the
>>>> Projektzwo bull bars that we sell.  I can only tell you
> about them that
>>>
>>>> one of my customers hit an antelope with one and it bent
> the bull bar
>>>> some but the front of the van was unhurt.  Pretty tough.
> Then they
>>>> just bent the bumper back again (torch and welding
> equipment required)
>>>> and they were good to go.  Just FYI.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Ken Wilford
>>>> John 3:16
>>>> http://www.vanagain.com
>>>> http://www.strictlyvwauctions.com
>>>> Phone: (856)-327-4936
>>>> Fax: (856)-327-2242
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List
> [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
>>>
>>>> Of robertmstewart
>>>> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2003 12:28 PM
>>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>>> Subject: Re: Vanagon Bush Guard /Bumpers
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Anyone know if all of these bush guards or rear guards
> actually do
>>>>> anything to protect the van in event of an accident?,
> some look like
>>>
>>>>> it might do more damage.
>>>>>
>>>>>  I have seem some of these things mounted in Jeep?s
> and some appear
>>>>> to
>>>>
>>>>> attached to very weak areas. I just wonder what would
> happened if I
>>>>> rear ended someone (or hit a tree or deer) with one of
> these things
>>>>> on
>>>>
>>>>> what kind of protection it would offer the front end
> of the van, the
>>>
>>>>> driver and front passenger?
>>>>>
>>>>> Can the front of the Van truly be protected from
> damage from a high
>>>>> impact accident with a bush guard?
>>>>>
>>>>> Are they worth their high costs?
>>>>>
>>>>> What?s their benefit other than looking cool?
>>>>>
>>>>> What?s the best unit available and from what dealer?
>>>>>
>>>>> Robert
>>>>> NYC
>>>>> 89 Carat
>>>>> ----------
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyone had any experience with Fast Forward Vanagon
> Bush Bumpers?.
>>>>> Is
>>>>
>>>>> there a cheaper option available?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>
>>>>> Noel
>>>>> 82 Westy
>>>
>>> ____________________________________________________________
> _____
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>>
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