I think extremists, conservative or liberal, generally do much more harm
than good.  As for MTBE, I believe it's implementation was financially
driven, not ecological.  And like so many things that extremists implement,
it backfired badly.

Cheers,

Jeff

-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM]On Behalf
Of Doug in Calif
Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 4:49 PM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: Bears, no offensive commentary included

Jeff, my apologies.
You are right.

"In the great state of California we take great pride in being idiots in
this
> way. It is so out of control most of the common public has been
brainwashed
> into actually believing allot of this crap.

I should have said "In the great state of California THERE ARE THOSE WHO
take great pride in being idiots in this
> way. It is so out of control IN MY OPINION most of the common public has
been brainwashed
> into actually believing allot of this crap.

Jeff,
What is your position on MTBE and the current environmentalists Sierra Club
mentality?
I feel its out of control in our state. I feel the folks behind the MTBE
scandal should do jail time.

Doug

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff at Vanagonparts" <jeff@VANAGONPARTS.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 4:20 PM
Subject: Re: Bears, no offensive commentary included

> Please speak for yourself only.  Some us Californians do not appreciate
> being stereotyped.
>
> Thank You,
>
> Jeff
> Sacramento, CA (lifetime CA resident)
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM]On Behalf
> Of Doug in Calif
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 3:58 PM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Re: Bears, no offensive commentary included
>
>
> This is EXACTLY why I posted the albeit somewhat controversial post about
> bears and "respecting nature".
> It is my belief as Ronald Regan said some of the "environmentalists" are
so
> whacked out about being "environmentalists" and "respecting nature" they
> miss "reality" and would make a birds nest out the White House if they
> could.
>
> In the great state of California we take great pride in being idiots in
this
> way. It is so out of control most of the common public has been
brainwashed
> into actually believing allot of this crap. Example MTBE is now polluted
> most of the ground water out here in the name of "clean air" what a snow
job
> from the environmentalists and "nature lovers" who are really out of
control
> idiots.
>
> I wish I could only worry about a ticket, heck they are talking about
> IMPOUNDING you vehicle for committing such offenses. So you better read,
> read, and read, up on the "rules" before you tread into Yosemite
campgrounds
> for sure, which is where most of these "rules" seem to be the worst.
> Yosemite has been ruined by over population and now has become so over run
> with people and rules its disgusting.
>
> Doug
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Karl Wolz" <wolzphoto@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 3:21 PM
> Subject: Re: Bears, no offensive commentary included
>
>
> > Mark,
> >
> > Then only place I've been given a hard time re: bear/food storage is in
> > (you guessed it) California STATE Parks.
> >
> > Karl Wolz
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> > Behalf Of
> > > Mark Edwards
> > > Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 1:30 PM
> > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > > Subject: Bears, no offensive commentary included
> > >
> > > I am reading posts from folks who say they, or someone they know, gets
> > > ticketed for having a candy bar on the seat, or even just for visible
> > food
> > > in their car.
> > >
> > > I admit I never checked all the URLs that were posted. Slow connection
> > on
> > > my laptop, so I avoid the web for the most part......
> > >
> > > I haven't been everywhere just yet, but in years of traveling and
> > camping
> > > in bear country in WY, ID, MT and even UT, I have not ever heard of
> > such
> > > rules and regs. Yellowstone is my second home, and no slouch in bear
> > > issues, and if you DON'T store your food in the car, you are in big
> > > trouble :-) There are bear boxes but they are mostly a courtesy, not
> > > mandatory, except for back country which seldom includes a car :-)
> > >
> > > Where are these places where you cannot store food in your car? I ask
> > in
> > > disbelief, but I don't dispute anyone's word. Its just that after 25
> > years
> > > of camping in bear country, that is news to me. I thought all NF, NP,
> > BLM,
> > > etc rules pertaining to bears and wildlife were basically the same
> > > everywhere. From now on, maybe identifying these places will benefit
> > > others in future visits.
> > >
> > > If I travel to these places that does not allow food in the car, will
> > I
> > > see this information posted, or given to me upon entrance? All my
> > camping
> > > life, I have been told that a car is where the food goes, so I guess
> > its
> > > good to read all the posts around here so I can learn even more
> > <shrug>
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > Mark