i agree with bob here.  every 1.9 that i have taken apart for inspection
had the bearing manufacturers name beat in the case saddles by the crank
and had wobbly bearing pins.  i would never consider rebuilding a 1.9
without line boring it first.  all that said i recently installed a
gowesty 2212 for a guy and they give a big breakdown of what they did to
build the engine and how much it cost.  including the machine work done in
the process.  a line bore was not listed although i didn't bother to ask
them i assume that it wasn't done.  not line boring the case would be on
par with the other shoddy work they did on that engine build.  i didn't
bother to ask because they don't have break in instructions or a correct
timing setting that they are willing to admit to, warranty void if the
timing isn't set right though :(.

jonathan

On Tue, 28 Sep 2004, ROBERT DONALDS wrote:

> Doug
> the 1.9 case bearing combo is tricky in the sense that you cant make a
> judgment call about the way the bearing fits in the case or the apparent
> wear of the saddle without measuring both.
> Again case shift makes it hard to do this even when you measure. Time will
> tell some start having issues at 20 K when the oil light starts flickering
> again.Keep in mind the 1.9 is different than the bug for a few reasons
> sustained RPM, load AND case alloy. The 2.1 case is a major upgrade for
> bearing fit and case wear I measure every 2.1 block that comes threw my door
> and align boring is the exception not the rule. I have written about the oil
> pressure problem the 2.1 develops at 130 to 150 K To recap I measured almost
> every rod core for months depending on the mileage the rod distorts over
> time and the bearing clearance increases to a point that the oil pressure
> drops. The 1.9 engine has the same rod but the bolt just is different and
> this distortion is not taking place.
> see my low oil pressure at warm idle article at
> http://www.bostonengine.com/articles/low-oil-pressure.htm
> out of round on the case is a judgment call case shift verses web wear.Rod
> out of rod the rods are out to begin with. When speaking if rods and size
> its often referred to in terms of at the parting line and opposite the
> parting line.The split bearings, both main and rod have a taper built into
> the bearing they are thinner at the parting line.
> The ability to measure is a key component in longevity
> Rebuilding engines is about restoring clearances and compression.
> Reassembling engines is more about learning where things go and what not to
> do next time
>
> hope this helps
> Bob Donalds
> all rights reserved
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Doug in Calif" <vanagon@astound.net>
> To: "ROBERT DONALDS" <donalds1@verizon.net>; <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2004 5:14 AM
> Subject: Re: Re: BLOCK BEARING SIZES ...
>
>
> > Thanks Bob,
> > I knew you had the experience to shed additional light on the subject.
> > Interesting that the 1.9s, you say always need bore.
> > I rebuilt my 1.9 and the case had plenty of crush on the bearing and no
> > ridge in the saddle.
> > its got 40k on it and still going strong with good oil press.
> > I have been hearing all sorts of stuff about the 2.1s oil press issue that
> > it may be related to this.
> >
> > How much out of round do you allow?
> >
> > Doug
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "ROBERT DONALDS" <donalds1@verizon.net>
> > To: "Doug in Calif" <vanagon@ASTOUND.NET>; <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> > Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 1:14 PM
> > Subject: Re: Re: BLOCK BEARING SIZES ...
> >
> >
> >> Doug
> >> I measure everything and aign bore when needed.
> >>  the Porsche shop may have not been able to measure so they had the case
> > cut
> >> then they don't have to worry the problem is that the next time you are
> > out
> >> of luck if it needs to be done again
> >> I know form experience that all bug cases need to be cut as do vanagon
> >> air-cooled cases and 1.9 vanagon cases EVERY TIME and I can go out to
> > 040th
> >> over  on the 1.9
> >> The 2.1 engine need to be checked but its hard to tell the difference
> >> between case shift and out of round to get around this you could use the
> >> front and rear bearing to bring the case into true and then measure the
> >> middle webs those are the ones you need to keep an eye on.
> >> I prep the case half's and use a tool I had made that installs into the
> > case
> >> seal openings as I bolt them together.  I then I use a slide hammer to
> >> pop
> >> them out then the bore mike tell no lies
> >> I have spent thousands to be able to accurately measure engine parts
> >> becuase thats is what its all about
> >>
> >> going faster miles an hour with the radio on
> >> I remain
> >>
> >> Bob Donalds
> >> Boston Engine Exchange
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Doug in Calif" <vanagon@ASTOUND.NET>
> >> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> >> Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2004 3:41 PM
> >> Subject: Re: BLOCK BEARING SIZES ...
> >>
> >>
> >> > Hi Bob,
> >> > Hey can you answer a quick question to those engine builders on the
> >> > left
> >> > coast.
> >> > What criteria do you use to determine if a water boxer case does indeed
> >> > need
> >> > an align bore?
> >> >
> >> > I am in the camp to never align bore a case unless its absolutely
> >> > necessary.
> >> >
> >> > I remember when I was 16 yrs old and rebuilding my 356 Porsche Super 90
> >> > engine for my
> >> > porsche powered sunroof beetle, I had spoke with Bill Shoreman from
> > Lukes
> >> > and Shorman here in the bay area.
> >> > He told me "Every engine that comes to L&S gets an align bore"  I
> >> > apparently
> >> > ticked him off when I took issue with that.
> >> >
> >> > Super 90 cases were well over 1200 bucks back in 1977 when I was doing
> >> > this
> >> > and I rebuilt my engine with standard bearings
> >> > and it worked out fine. Hopefully that engine case is still in service
> >> > someplace.
> >> >
> >> > Just curious what your position and experience shows.
> >> >
> >> > Doug
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > ----- Original Message -----
> >> > From: "ROBERT DONALDS" <donalds1@VERIZON.NET>
> >> > To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> >> > Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2004 12:19 PM
> >> > Subject: Re: BLOCK BEARING SIZES ...
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> what year is the van ?
> >> >> I stock over 300 sets of German Main bearings and I am sure I can help
> >> >> you
> >> >> with your machining needs and questions on sizes
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Bob Donalds
> >> >> Boston Engine Exchange
> >> >>  1 508 358 6264
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> >> From: "zolo" <zolo@FOXINTERNET.NET>
> >> >> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> >> >> Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2004 1:51 PM
> >> >> Subject: BLOCK BEARING SIZES ...
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Hello to the List,
> >> >> I have a block that I just took apart and would like to know what the
> >> > sizes
> >> >> inside should be.  I am thinking that one or more of the inside sizes
> > has
> >> >> increased and the block may have to be cut to the next size.  Also the
> >> >> question would be then; what size it has to be cut to and who can do
> >> >> it
> >> >> aroung here in the Seattle area.  And who sells those bearings that
> > have
> >> >> bigger outside diameter sizes.  Throwing the block away and buying a
> > new
> >> > one
> >> >> is totally against the spirit of the List.  We are here to do constant
> >> >> makovers on our beloved friends.
> >> >> I hope, some of you would know what I am talking about and give
> > answers.
> >> >> Regards, Zoltan
> >>
> >
>
>
>