Wow, you really get everything on this list!
My grandfather had a Goggomobil, the limousine I think.  I rode in it a couple times.
I think my cousin still has it.
-Hans

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeffrey Schwaia" <jeff@VANAGONPARTS.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 6:32 PM
Subject: Re: Vngns ARE junk!(Minivans)

Robert,

How about a '58 Goggomobil?

http://www.goggomobil.com/gallery/transporter/transporter.html

Or perhaps you prefer the Doka?

http://www.goggomobil.com/gallery/pickup/pickup.html

Cheers,

Jeff

-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM]On Behalf
Of Robert Keezer
Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 9:55 AM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: Vngns ARE junk!(Minivans)

Hey- I think Subaru had one of the first minivans,
L@@K -

http://www.cars101.com/oldsubpictures.html

Robert

1982 Westfalia

--- Jeffrey Earl <jefferrata@YAHOO.COM> wrote:
> >> Please, do compare the Vanagon and its
> reliability
> to anything else designed in the late 70's.  Do
> compare it to other 20+year old vehicles.  Let's
> draw
> relevant conclusions.
>
> and
>
> >> Tell me that a 20 year old caravan runs problem
> free. All older cars require maintanance!
>
>
> I assume you gentlemen read no more than the first
> paragraph of my original post before gleefully
> depressing your "Reply" buttons.
>
> Had you proceeded even to the next sentence you
> would
> have read me doing exactly what you request:
> comparing
> the 1980 Vanagon to a 1980 Mustang, or by
> implication,
> any other 20-year-old vehicle of your choice. And my
> conclusion was that, as you say, ALL 20-year-old
> cars
> will require extra care and maintenance. I maintain,
> however, that the Vanagon will require even a little
> bit more ... (wink)
>
> Chris, to compare the Vanagon to a Dodge Caravan is
> more than fair. In fact, according to this webpage
> for
> Chrysler minivan enthusiasts (and I thought we
> Vanageeks were oddballs):
>
> "The Dodge Caravan and Plymouth Voyager were first
> introduced to the world in 1983, but Chrysler had
> actually started working on them in the early 1970s,
> with full development starting in 1980. Indeed, one
> engineer told us that the launch was originally to
> be
> in 1981, but that the minivan project was put on
> hold
> for the Y-body Imperial."
> http://www.allpar.com/model/m/history.html
>
> So it seems the Vanagon and the Caravan are very
> close
> automotive cousins, conceived nearly simultaneously
> and born within two years of each other. The article
> goes on to say:
>
> "Who invented the minivan?
>
> "Chrysler invented the modern minivan - twice.
> Richard
> Moss pointed out that Chrysler Europe was working
> with
> Matra on a minivan in the late 1970s / early 1980s.
> ... Matra took the design to Renault, which modified
> it to fit the Renault 21 drivetrain...resulting in a
> calendar-year 1983 introduction and Europe's most
> popular minivan. ... The American Plymouth Voyager
> and
> Dodge Caravan were also introduced in 1983, as 1984
> models."
>
> The article seems to ignore the existence of VW
> Vanagons on American streets as early as 1980(!),
> and
> if the earlier Busses/Transporters weren't "mini
> vans", I don't know what is.
>
> I love my Vanagon Westy like no other vehicle I've
> owned. You can have it only when you pry my
> lifeless,
> mangled corpse from its crumpled, steely clutches.
> But
> I am not blind to the Vanagon's peculiar foibles,
> and
> a little honest self-evaluation never hurt anyone.
> Or
> a van ...
>
>
> Jeffrey Earl
> 1983 diesel Westfalia "Vanasazi"
> http://www.vanthology.com/
>
>
>
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