Please understand that these are NOT Vanagon motor cases, but rather
type 1  (Beetle) cases. The Vanagon transaxle IS, I believe, magnesium,
however. The last type 2 vehincle that had a magnesium case was the
1971. The type 4 engines were aluminum. (Not sure of the CN 1.6 liter
petrol engines used in Euro versions in early 1980's.)
Al Brase

Robert Fisher wrote:

> The firefighting training I went through in the Navy had a intensive
> section
> on magnesium fires, largely because the aircraft have so much
> magnesium in
> them. Add that to the fact that many of those aircraft will also have
> ordnance attached to them and it makes a pretty problem.
>
> The way they explained it to us was that magnesium has a high enough
> oxygen
> content in of itself that it will burn solely on its own oxygen once
> ignited. I don't know any more about it than what I was told, although
> some
> googling brought up some information that confirmed that information.
> I also
> saw some information that supports what John said as well,
> particularly the
> CO2.
>
> The Navy used a training video that showed a loaded fighter on fire, at
> night. Basically the technique in fighting those fires is to push the
> thing
> overboard. They had a few shots from different cameras showing the
> burning
> plane going into the water and then sinking. You could very clearly
> see the
> bright light from the fire as the plane sank, and the narration said that
> the fire was still visible at an estimated 200 feet- which is kind of
> astounding if you think about it. They don't even bother trying to
> fight the
> fire because if they lose control of the situation the plane (or
> rather, the
> burning magnesium mass) could melt its way down through the ship. They
> know
> this because it has happened.
>
> I saw this played out once on the Midway. It's a long story how the
> entire
> situation came to pass, but it wound up with the burning plane going over
> the side. I was thinking 'wow, 50 million right down the pisser...' They
> didn't even bother trying to get near the plane, nevermind trying to do
> anything about the fire. One lone guy (how'd you like to have this job?)
> caught it on his tractor on the side away from the fire, pushed it to the
> side of the forecastle and jumped just before the whole thing went over.
>
> Those of you that are doing these case fires might want to reconsider,
> or at
> least do some reading before you continue. The simple fact that it
> can't be
> put out readily is a problem in of itself, but there are other
> dangers- eye
> damage from the intensity of the flames, the fumes can be poisonous, etc.
> Didn't sit down to do a thesis paper but a quick scan gave a pretty clear
> picture.
>
> Additionally, the magnesium is highly reactive to acids (think of this
> when
> you're choosing an engine cleaner) and in the presence of those and even
> plain water can make it give off hydrogen gas- there were lots of 'flash
> fire' hazard warnings.
>
> Finally, I think all this lends even more weight to the fuel line
> issue. I'm
> thinking those burnt out hulks we've all seen pictures of may have
> more to
> do with the engine catching fire after the fuel fire than 'just' the fuel
> fire itself.
>
> Just some food for thought-
> Cya,
> Robert
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Rodgers" <inua@CHARTER.NET>
> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 7:49 AM
> Subject: Re: Firewood
>
>
>> Magnesium - once lit - will burn under water. Heat is so intense and
>> chemical reaction so fierce that it splits the oxygen from the water
>> molecule for it's own use in combustion. Tough to fight a fire like that
>> with water. CO2 extinguishers don't work very well either. The intensity
>> of the chemical reaction in the magnesium is such that it also splits
>> off the oxygen from the carbon in the CO2 and consumes it. Carbon is the
>> leftover byproduct of magnesium combustion and it makes a heck of a
>> carbon soot mess. The intensity of the cold of a discharging CO2
>> extinguisher might chill the  magnesium sufficiently to reduce and then
>> snuff the flame, but I would not count on it. I can't say I have ever
>> seen a magnesium fire extinguished successfully- it only went out when
>> it burned  itself out.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> John Rodgers
>> 88 GL Driver
>>
>>
>> ROBERT DONALDS wrote:
>>
>>> I machine the bug cases so I have magnesium flakes that collect over
>>> time
>>> one night I took a large hand full out into the ally and lit it on
>>> fire not
>>> very impressive until I kicked it with my boot it then lighted up the
>>> ally
>>> like daylight and then some funny what a little sturring will do
>>> water will not put this out
>>> Bob
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Bill Collins" <wb6otg@INTREX.NET>
>>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>>> Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 9:00 AM
>>> Subject: Re: Firewood
>>>
>>>
>>>> >Wood is nice, but I highly recommend burning an engine case (ala
>>>>
>>>>> Burning Van 06).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Just make sure no one throws water on it!  Someone did that the last
>>>> time
>>>> they burned one at Everybus. (I think that's part of the reason it
>>>> was the
>>>> LAST time)
>>>>
>>>> Bill
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>