In a message dated 07/01/2007 1:53:13 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
campahvan@earthlink.net writes:

In a  message dated 05/01/2007 11:25:18 P.M. Eastern Standard  Time,
LISTSERV@GERRY.VANAGON.COM writes:

Question  about front  springs for an '87 Vanagon  Westy.  Planning  to
rejuvenate  the front suspension of my '87 Westy now  with 500,000  kms,  I
purchased a
set of front springs from the Bus Depot, part    #  "251 411 105 A 952,
front,
BOGE, standard height for  Vanagon  or  Camper".  Today I disassembled the
front
end  of my Westy and  removed the  springs which to my knowledge have  never
been
replaced  previously.  When I  put the old  springs next to the new ones I
saw
that the new springs are more   than 1" shorter than the ones I  removed.
Puzzled to say the  least.   So what I want to know  is:

Bus Depot:   Did you send me the correct   springs ?  Wrong spring in  the
right box ?  Or ??

List members:  Has anyone had this  experience  ?  What  did you do ?  Will
the shorter  springs work or are they just   plain wrong ?

Something's not  right and I need help   please !!

Has no  one besides me  bought these springs from the Bus Depot ?  Reason  I
ask is that I have  not received any responses from anyone who  has.  Nor
have I
received an  answer from the Bus  Depot.

    OK, for those interested here's what I've found out  thus far.  Below are
the responses I've received on this issue and  following that are my
conclusions.

    From: _starwagen@gmail.com_ (mailto:starwagen@gmail.com)
RE: New front springs...
Waiting in the wings for the answers since I  need to get the front end of my
'90 Westy back up where it belongs....

    From: _rubatoguy@comcast.net_ (mailto:rubatoguy@comcast.net)
I thought the Bus Depot BOGE springs were the lower 'sport'  springs.

I think the factory went to lower springs late in the model run  89 or so..
but an 1" is quite a difference.
I had some H&R lowering  springs and they were about the same difference you
describe - I can send you a  photo if you like

regards,
Todd

    From: _hansachter@hotmail.com_ (mailto:hansachter@hotmail.com)
Frank,
What are the paint marks on the stock springs you  removed?
-Hans

    From: _CTONLINE@webtv.net_ (mailto:CTONLINE@webtv.net)
<< I purchased a set of front springs from the Bus Depot, part #  "251
411 105 A 952, front, BOGE, standard height for Vanagon or Camper".
When I put the old springs next to the new ones I saw that the  new
springs are more than 1" shorter than the ones I removed. Puzzled to  say
the least.
Bus  Depot: Did you send me the correct springs ?
Wrong spring in the
right box  ? Or ??
List members: Has  anyone had this experience ?
What did you do ? Will
the shorter springs  work or are they just
plain wrong ?>>

Don't be puzzled here  Frankie, the root of the problem is obvious.

You've got the wrong springs  if they are shorter than the OE springs you
just yanked outa the  Van.

Unless-- the coil windinga are larger, or you have a set  of
progressively wound springs , which I doubt, the BD even has.

Why  don't you drop Ronnie a line, and ask him?

I'm sure he'll have an  eloquent 2 page long answer for you.

Whatever you have there is wrong,  not correct.

The new springs should be a bit longer when fresh outa the  box.

Your a smart guy Frankie--you should have known this.

______________
|[  ] [  ] [ ]\
|    |    |    |
~~~ ~||-(())----(())-|

Terry--

" Brrrrrr, Pop,  Bang, Pow!  "

   From: _dnd.obryan@comcast.net_ (mailto:dnd.obryan@comcast.net)
Frank,

I too got springs from Bus Depot.  Front and rear.   They were both about one
inch shorter than stock.  I put them on and am  very happy with the ride.
That combined with 15 inch rims and Michelin  Aegilis tires seem to work well
together.  Never had such little  sway/roll in corners and the wind doesn't
blow me around anywhere near as  much as it used to.

YMMV.

Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru  EJ25

    From: _ron@busdepot.com_ (mailto:ron@busdepot.com)
Frank,

VW used various spring heights on various models/years of  Vanagons. Boge
makes only one replacement spring, and it is basically the  middle of the
three heights. So it may be a bit shorter than the springs used  on some
campers, but taller than, say, a Wolfsburg edition. It will work fine  on
your camper, although it may alter ride height slightly.  That's why  my
listing recommends replacing all 4 at once, so that if you are  replacing
original springs that were slightly taller or slightly shorter the  height
will still be even front and rear.

If your existing springs  are taller, you may currently have the other
version listed here:

http://busdepot.com/view.jsp?model=43&category=19&group=129&prodgroup=1014

They  are available only from VW, and as you can see they are about twice  the
price. You could see if your existing springs have part numbers on them,  or
else there should be a colored paint mark on the springs that can be used  to
identify them. (I believe ETKA identifies the paint marks.)  This may  also
identify whether the springs you have are original for the year or not.  If
so, you could use them to maintain a taller ride, although others prefer  the
middle sized springs on campers because it allows the camper to fit  into
more parking garages (or home garages).

    From: _campahvan@earthlink.net_ (mailto:campahvan@earthlink.net)
Hi Frank,

This will not help you much but I did buy the same springs  from TBD
(actually all 4) to replace the H&R lowering springs that were  on my
Transporter single cab when I bought it.  I wasn't able to inspect  the
original springs but, as expected, the H&R's were considerable  shorter than
the new standard Boge's.  I've attached a couple of  comparison photos for
your consideration.

I also replaced the  existing 4 Koni shocks (the rears were too short when I
installed the new  springs) with the OEM Boge/Sachs hydraulic shocks.
While the front end was  disassembled I decided to also replace the worn out
radial arm bushings with  sleeves and L & R tie rod ends.  The upper and
lower ball joints had  been replaced by the previous owner.  I am using a
stock size tire  (Cooper SRM II, Load range D, 1875 lbs @ 65 psi) and I
believe it drives and  handles like new.  It has no trouble handling a cord
of dry firewood  though the 1.6 TD feels the load!

I am considering replacing the springs  on my 85 Westy with the same standard
Boge springs and I would like to hear  about your results.

Andrew
Bainbridge Island WA

   From: _hansachter@hotmail.com_ (mailto:hansachter@hotmail.com)

Hmmm...  If I remember correctly, the paint marks were on the top end  of the
springs when I did Genevieve's van (90 westy).
I would have guessed brown marks also.
My guess is that somewhere along the line someone changed them for 84/85
double yellow springs.  The marks being on the bottom of the spring might
support that theory also.  I would think the factory would install them  with the
paint marks on the top end so they would last longer and also for ease  of
reading them.  That's what I found on Genevieve's van (a single  owner
well-cared-for van).
I seem to recall that your van sits rather high, so it definitely doesn't
have the lowering springs on it.
I swapped the lowering springs in Genevieve's van for the 85 springs to  give
it more ground clearance for taller tires.
-Hans

From:    Mark  Drillock <mdrillock@COX.NET>
Subject: Re: vanagon spring rate color  coding for different models...READ!!

Sorry, but I don't think those  colors are right.
There are 4 replacement part numbers for 2 wd fronts, but  in only 3 colors.

For FRONT springs ONLY I think it is something like  this:

Yellow was used in some tall early years(83-85 Campers?) as well  as
later lowered passenger models, different numbers, visibly  longer
earlier spring.

Blue is the common passenger models, standard  height, all years?

Brown is for Westy Campers starting in late  1985.

(Syncro front all the same, violet.)

The springs can  have 1,2,or 3 paint marks of the same color. This was
for a matching pair.  For example, there would be a slight difference
between 1 blue mark and 2  blue marks though they had the same part
number and VW would match the  springs on each van by number of marks.

Mark

So............what to make of all this !   Looks like the springs that I
removed from my '87 Westy have one yellow mark and  are about 1" taller than the
Boge springs from the Bus Depot.  From  all information my Van should have the
two brown marked springs.  Maybe  that was a brown mark, I can't be sure, as
the amount of rust on the springs  surely has removed any markings that I can
decipher properly.  So what to  do ?  I have now decided to install and use the
Boge springs I got from the  Bus Depot and report back my findings.  Stay
tuned !

Cheers,

Frank  Condelli
Almonte, Ontario, Canada
'87 Westy, '90 Carat, '87 Wolfsburg  (Forsale) & Lionel Trains (_Collection
for  sale_ (http://members.aol.com/Fkc43/trainsal.htm) )
Vanagon/Vanagon Westfalia Service in the Ottawa Valley
_Frank Condelli &  Associates_ (http://members.aol.com/Fkc43/busindex.html)
_Vanagon  Stainless Steel Exhaust Systems_
(http://members.aol.com/Fkc43/stebro.htm)
_BusFusion_ (http://members.aol.com/BusFusion/bfhome.htm)  a VW Camper
camping event, Almonte, ON, June 07 ~ 10,  2007