Well Dave, what IS the weight of the poptop and luggage rack?

Enquiring minds want to know.

On 9/7/07, David Milo <dellaone@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Okay Okay,
>
> What then, do you see as the perceived advantages of carbon fiber over the
> fiber glass construction of the conventional pop top?
>
> Aside from the fact that the aerodynamic drag will be the same if designed
> the same, are you anticipating that it will save you 100 pounds of weight?
> Do you know what an average existing pop top weighs? (I do, and the cost
> to
> benefit ratio isn't there).
>
> I've been to a training course on composites in Reno Nevada, very neat
> stuff
> and lots of options available to meet specialized design requirements
> (graphite, Kevlar etc,) but fabrication with the materials involved
> generally requires a kiln and age and temperature control on the raw
> materials (adding to the cost).
>
> Plus, it is generally nasty to repair, it still needs specialized
> knowledge,
> a kiln and expensive materials (try to find a carbon fiber repair kit at
> NAPA) to perform properly, and can cause lung damage if the proper
> precautions aren't taken when working with it, (even simple stuff like
> drilling through it to add whatever, roof racks etc).
>
> Yes, a carbon fiber bike frame is very light and strong, but also very
> brittle, and expensive (or impossible) to repair locally.
>
> I'll pass.
>
> Dave
>
> On 9/7/07, Chris S. <mrpolak@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > Live it to the list to tear any idea to shreds.
> >
> > Your pricing MIGHT be a little off.  You can get carbon fiber hoods for
> > about $800.
> >
> > Max Wellhouse <maxjoyce@IPA.NET> wrote: $500?  The last time I checked,
> > graphite cloth in a 6 oz, weight was
> > selling for about $75/yd.  I don't remember if that was 38"wide cloth
> > or 60", but the fact of the mater is that you're looking at maybe 3
> > layers minimum to make that top stiff enough unless you took some
> > sort of foam core stiffener and that carbon top would likely not
> > survive much of a hail storm either.  The foam core stuff ain't cheap
> > either. d.  Something with that many convolutions would almost have
> > to be vacuum-bagged and I'd want a couple of layers of kevlar under
> > the foam core just for strength. The kevlar is a bargain at like
> > $15-18 a yard if you get it from www.sweetcomposites.com  Then
> > there's the cost of making the mold for the top after you make the
> > male plug to make the mold from.  The Westy top wouldn't be rigid
> > enough to mold.
> >
> > Let's see, that first carbon top would cost about $12,000, and the
> > next one maybe only $2,000 if you di all the work yourself.
> >
> > DM&FS
> >
> > At 10:34 PM 9/6/2007, Don Hanson wrote:
> >
> > >a Van top from carbon fiber, while it would be very trick, from a
> > practical
> > >standpoint makes little sense.  Unless you're Bill Gates or Jay Leno or
> > >someone with lots of money to spend on a questionable project.  The
> > amount
> > >of material you'd use to make the part...fiberglass or carbon fiber..
> is
> > a
> > >lot.  Glass fabric is a little heavier and not quite so stiff, but it
> is
> > >about 1/100th the cost of carbon fabric..In a piece as large as a
> Westie
> > >style roof, you might save oh, say 20-30 lbs, by using carbon fiber
> > rather
> > >than the normal glass,  but you'd probably spend $500 doing it...You
> > could
> > >save almost that much weight just by vacuum-bagging a fiberglass lay up
> > and
> > >being very careful with the fabrication..
> > >   Now, in a racecar or a bicycle or an America's cup yacht or an
> > >airplane...that kinda dollar per lb. may be worth it..but for the top
> of
> > a
> > >Vanagon?  Prolly not to normal humans...
> > >   Don Hanson
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.
> >
>

--
Jake
1984 Vanagon GL
1986 Westy Weekender "Dixie"
www.crescentbeachguitar.com