Hi neil,

Cost, especially a one time only cost, isn't that big a deal.

Excessie unnessary weight is though.

Why are you not using the rear engine mounting bar on your 85 donor?

It's a fine piece to start with.  

Is there any cut-out in your oil pan at all ? 

Scott 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
neil N
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2008 12:39 PM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: Building carrier (load bar) Square or rectangular tube steel?

 

See. This is what I mean by "more educated minds". And for sure

opinions and thoughts from others with more or different experience.

 

Doing an engine conversion like this (yes I was warned!) encompasses

quite a few areas of knowledge. And is pushing me to learn more which

is great. Unfortunately, some areas I lack a total background in. Uh,

like I failed Physics 11. And Algebra 11. And when I requested to take

welding class, my HS councillor told me to try Algebra again. ??

Yeesh! --- ;^)

 

Going by pics of someones elses design to make the carrier is a

challenge in that I want to do it as "right" as I can. No negative

reflection on the original designer. I like the way the design looks

and he has been helpful. Still a challenge, though pics REALLY help.

 

I would have been in the dark with wet matches had I not seen them.

 

I'm sure mild steel will do the job. This carrier will likely be

over-built when I'm done with it.

 

Extra weight and material costs be damned! --- :^)

 

Neil.

 

 

 

 

On 3/15/08, John Rodgers <inua@charter.net> wrote:

> My experience with the tube strength issues comes mostly form my work

> years ago with welding on small aircraft airframes. Most that I worked

> with were constructed of round tubular steel. It has been a long time,

> but I seem to remember that most were made of 4130 chromaloy steel., a

> very strong, tough metal. Welded up properly a section made of this was

> practically indestructible in compression loads. But bending loads were

> another matter, and that applies to most any round tube. Square or

> rectangular had limited application. They were used, but not for full

> frame construction. Those kinds of tubes has special applications.

>

> John Rodgers

> 88 GL Driver

> neil N wrote:

> > Thanks John.

> >

> > This is also what the metal guy expressed, so I was curious to "hear"

> > what more educated minds had to say. FWIW, the stock air cooled (and

> > WBX I think) is very much a rectangular shape. From memory, looks like

> > 1" by .5" Obviously designed to handle L to R movement.

> >

> > I have some scraps of hot rolled 2"x2" and plate steel (that the metal

> > guy kindly gave me) that I can try my hand at for practice fitting and

> > welding. I will play with wood scraps to find my angles first. It

> > looks like it's all 45's with the exception of the 90 needed to hang

> > from the subframe.

> >

> > Once I get the engine at the right "height", and make some test pieces

> > out of wood, I should be able to determine how long the long side of

> > the rectangle can be before the bottom of the carrier hangs too low

> > below oil pan.

> >

> > (he says thinking outloud to no one in particular --- ;^)

> >

> > Neil.

> >

> >

> >

> > On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 10:35 AM, John Rodgers <inua@charter.net> wrote:

> >

> >> Neil,

> >>

> >> I'm not an engineer, but I would think that a tube with rectangular

> >> crossection would have the greater strength, depending on the
directions

> >> loads are applied. Just my opinion.

> >>

> >> John Rodgers

> >> 88 GL Driver

> >> Chelsea, AL - where it's thundering, lightening, and pouring down rain.

> >> Ahhh! Spring showers!

> >>

> >>

> >>

> >> neil N wrote:

> >> > Hi all.

> >> >

> >> > I am ready to fabricate the engine carrier for my 15 degree Jetta

> conversion.

> >> >

> >> > Is 1/8" - 2"x2" hot rolled tube rigid enough?

> >> >

> >> > Or should I use rectangular tube? ( 2"x 2.2.5" ? 2" x 2.5" ?)

> >> >

> >> > Will the rectangular shape add strength/stability ?

> >> >

> >> > For sure 2" is needed for base of Fox mounts I'm using.

> >> >

> >> >

> >> > TIA,

> >> >

> >> > Neil.

> >> >

> >> >

> >> >

> >> > --

> >> > Neil Nicholson. 1981 Air Cooled Westfalia - "Jaco"

> >> >

> >> > http://web.mac.com/tubaneil

> >> > http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/

> >> >

> >> >

> >> >

> >>

> >>

> >>

> >>

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Neil Nicholson. 1981 Air Cooled Westfalia - "Jaco"

> >

> > http://web.mac.com/tubaneil

> > http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

--

Neil Nicholson. 1981 Air Cooled Westfalia - "Jaco"

http://web.mac.com/tubaneil

http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/

 

 

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