I agree, getting your weight into the seat is necessary to get the lap belt tight. However, the
seat I had required the use of the rear tether when forward facing, which presented a
problem in the Westy. Since all cars since 1990 or so have anchors, these rear tether seats
may be standard now, I don't know, ours is now about 7-8 years old.

On 30 Mar 2008 at 7:24, Ryan Shawley <easywind1975@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:

> I can vouch for this, I have a forward facing seat in my Westy that doesn't move
> more than a half inch.  The trick is pre-adjusting the lap belt and then putting
> your weight into the seat to compress the bench seat foam.  It should look like
> your assaulting the seat to anyone passing by.
>
> Ryan
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike" <mbucchino@CHARTER.NET>
> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 21:03
> Subject: Re: Convertible car seat for Vanagon - Canadian Safety Standards
>
>
> > Apparently you missed this post. It should answer most of the issues you
> > said in your reply to me;
> >
> >
> >
> > Bruce,
> >
> >  The top tether strap is only for use in a rear-facing infant seat
> > application, to limit the seat's forward motion in a crash; it wouldn't
> > limit sideways motion at all, no matter which direction it's mounted.
> >  The best way to get a tight-fitting seat belt is to place your knee into
> > the seat while cinching the belt as tight as possible.  If you have to
> > pre-tighten the belt, then latch it in, due the belt's routing inside the
> > carseat, you still will need to press your weight on your knee into the seat
> > to compress the vehicle's seat foam enough to get the belt to latch very
> > tightly.  This trick was shown to me years ago, and it makes a huge
> > difference. Keep those kids safe! Mike B.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Bruce Todd" <beeceetee@GMAIL.COM>
> > To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 10:25 AM
> > Subject: Convertible car seat for Vanagon - Canadian Safety Standards
> >
> >
> >> I'm hoping the list can help me purchase the appropriate car seat for my
> >> toddler who has outgrown her rear facing infant seat.  I drive a 86 Westy
> >> Syncro with the current seat locked by the lap belt to the back bench seat -
> >> it seems pretty secure.
> >>
> >> The convertible seats, which are for children weighing between 22 to 65
> >> lbs
> >> (depending on the make) are more difficult to anchor securely and appear to
> >> be designed for more modern vehicles with latching systems and tether points.
> >>
> >> Last week we took our first camping trip and I swapped the car seat from our
> >> other vehicle, which is a convertible style seat, and fiddled around with it
> >> to get it to fit.  It ended up facing the rear and being relatively snug from
> >> front to back but not to my liking in terms of side to side movement. Part of
> >> the reason for this is it is difficult to cinch the lap belt super tight
> >> because of how the belt travels underneath the child seat.  The model of this
> >> seat, which is highly recommended, is a Sunshine Kids Radian - it fits quite
> >> well in our Honda CRV.
> >>
> >> When checking to see whether the seat fit any better frontward facing, I was
> >> disappointed to see that it didn't and was not very snug at all - especially
> >> from side to side.  I'm guessing this is the purpose of the top tether on the
> >> seat - to help stabilize the seat.  Obviously I would like to find a seat
> >> that fits front or rear facing and works to the specifications it is designed
> >> for.
> >>
> >> Anyway, I open this non-mechanical topic up to wise members of the
> >> Vanagon
> >> list.
> >>
> >> Many thanks,
> >>
> >> Bruce Todd
> >> Vancouver
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Shawn Wright" <vwdiesels@gmail.com>
> > To: "Mike" <mbucchino@charter.net>
> > Cc: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 4:54 PM
> > Subject: Re: Re: Convertible car seat for Vanagon - Canadian Safety
> > Standards
> >
> >
> >> Mike,
> >>
> >> The original poster asked for suggestions on how to more securely anchor
> >> seats in a vehicle never designed for this. I offered my solution. I also
> >> offered that the factory shoulder belts may also provide some solutions. I am
> >> quite certain the chain and assorted fastening links were significantly
> >> stronger than the rear tether straps provided on the car seat. This argument
> >> could go on endlessly, as the reality is there are no 'authoritative sources'
> >> on this issue when it comes to retro-fitting child restraints into vehicles
> >> not designed for them, so we must do the best we can. I checked with several
> >> sources before doing this, and none of them would consider designing a
> >> restraint for liability reasons. I do not claim my solution is the best way
> >> to go, only something to consider, and likely better than using the lap belt
> >> alone, which is explicitly stated as unsafe with many car seats. At the time,
> >> I was comfortable that the seat was as secure in my Westy as it was when
> >> installed in my Jetta, which uses a restraint based on the factory design
> >> added for the 1990 model year.
> >>
> >> I notice you mention your experience with buckling kids in safely, yet
> >> you
> >> don't offer any
> >> constructive advice for the original poster. I would love to hear it, as I do
> >> plan to be driving a Westy when the grand kids arrive. :-)
> >>
> >> As I mentioned, I pulled the junkyard belts myself, and was able to view the
> >> donor van, which had minimal body damage, so I was comfortable with the
> >> condition of the belts. Your point is probably valid, so for those concerned,
> >> GoWesty has the new ones.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Shawn
> >>
> >> On 29 Mar 2008 at 12:39, Mike <mbucchino@charter.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Shawn,
> >>>
> >>>   I can't say it's a good idea to engineer your own child seat
> >>> restraints. Using
> >>> 600lb chain?  Did you do an analysis to determine the average forward
> >>> G-forces
> >>> generated during a crash at so-many miles-per-hour and calculate the
> >>> weights of
> >>> your 2 kids buckled into thier seats, both yanking on that 1 length of
> >>> chain?  I
> >>> bet not.  It's your kids lives and health riding on it. What about when the
> >>> chain breaks loose and becomes a hard object to whip around and do some
> >>> really serious damage?  What is the strength rating of the quick-links?  A
> >>> chain is only as strong as it's weakest link, right?
> >>>   IMHO, it's not a very smart move in that dept.  I have 3 kids of my
> >>> own, 3
> >>> kids and a grandkid of my wife's, so I do have a little bit of
> >>> experience
> >>> with
> >>> buckling kiddies in safely.
> >>>   Also, is it ever a good practice to purchase junkyard seatbelts?
> >>> After
> >>> all, they're only designed to be good for one crash, and then they
> >>> should
> >>> be
> >>> replaced. Even earlier, if they're defective in any way (worn,
> >>> weathered,
> >>> torn,
> >>> frayed, stretched, aging, etc.).
> >>>   I don't think it's a good idea to 'advertise' your home-brewed safety
> >>> measures as a 'good way of doing things' to others on the list, either.
> >>>
> >>> Mike B.
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> From: "Shawn Wright" <vwdiesels@GMAIL.COM>
> >>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 12:02 PM
> >>> Subject: Re: Convertible car seat for Vanagon - Canadian Safety
> >>> Standards
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> > It's there on my '88 CDN model Westy, and I have installed shoulder
> >>> > belts from
> >>> > a '90 model on the right side. I plan to do the left side once I get
> >>> > around to
> >>> > pulling the cabinets. Our kids are 9 and 10, so I've been through all
> >>> > this, and the only way I was happy with the front facing seat was to make
> >>> > a rear anchor by running a piece of chain between the two seat mounting
> >>> > bolts*, then clipping the seat's rear mount belt clip into the chain link.
> >>> > This would allow me to make both seats very secure, by adjusting the rear
> >>> > strap tight enough so when the lap belt was clipped in, the seat was
> >>> > wedged very tightly into the foam.
> >>> >
> >>> > *the seat mounting "bolts" I mean are the large philips head machine
> >>> > screws visible on the
> >>> > rear deck just behind the seat at each corner. I removed them, and
> >>> > installed a standard metal
> >>> > car seat anchor hook, then a washer, then a longer bolt. I then linked the
> >>> > chain using threaded quick links at each side, and left the chain loose
> >>> > enough that it would reach about 1/2 way up the seat when attached to the
> >>> > car seat strap. The chain was chosen large enough that the car seat clips
> >>> > fit into the links, and has a breaking strength of at least 600lbs IIRC.
> >>> > I've used the same stuff to lift engines with... :-)
> >>> >
> >>> > All that said, since you will eventually want shoulder belts anyway,
> >>> > you may
> >>> > be able to devise a system using the rear should belt that works well
> >>> > also, and just do that. I got my belts and all the pieces for about $100
> >>> > from a wrecker, and pulled them myself, so I could see exactly how they
> >>> > installed, and got the plastic trim piece for the side panels, etc.
> >>> >
> >>> > On 29 Mar 2008 at 8:21, Paul Guzyk <paullist08@GUZYK.COM> wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >> According to GoWesty there is a threaded anchor behind the rear side
> >>> >> panel.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> "The reel mounts into a factory threaded hole - no drilling or
> >>> >> welding is required"
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Perhaps see if the threaded hole exists on your Cdn van then use it
> >>> >> to hold your existing seat securely?
> >>> >>
> >>> >> http://gowesty.com/ec_view_details.php?id=3218&search_phrase=child%20seat
> >>> >> %20a nch or&start=60
> >>> >>
> >>> >> item kt-122
> >>> >>
> >>> >> >I'm hoping the list can help me purchase the appropriate car seat
> >>> >> >for
> >>> >> >my
> >>> >> >toddler who has outgrown her rear facing infant seat.  I drive a 86
> >>> >> >Westy
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > Shawn Wright
> >>> > http://members.shaw.ca/vwdiesels
> >>> > '88 Westy 1.6TD 5 speed
> >>> > '85 Jetta Diesel 1.6NA
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> Shawn Wright
> >> http://members.shaw.ca/vwdiesels
> >> '88 Westy 1.6TD 5 speed
> >> '85 Jetta Diesel 1.6NA
> >>
> >>
> >

Shawn Wright
http://members.shaw.ca/vwdiesels
'88 Westy 1.6TD 5 speed
'85 Jetta Diesel 1.6NA