I'm kind of lost here - my husband is really interested in the Zetec but we
live in California.  Does this mean we cannot do the Zetec?  We have an 87
Syncro.

On 9/4/08, Jeff <vw.doka@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> After the lab test, the vehicle goes to a referee for final labeling and
> entry into the DMV system.  A copy of the lab certificate is required by
> the
> BAR, and the original goes to the DMV.
>
> When it comes to testing, California requires the whole shebang.  Think of
> it as EPA++, and the lab must be CARB certified.
>
> A lab "may" be able to offer a quantity discount.  I used to have a deal
> where my 5th test was free, but that was a few years back.
>
> Jeff
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jakiba@bostig.com [mailto:jakiba@bostig.com] On Behalf Of Jim Akiba
> Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 2:33 PM
> To: Jeff
> Cc: vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com
> Subject: Re: Was: Re: John Wessels Glori's --- Now: California Engine
> Conversions
>
> Yeah we were talking two different things... so does one of the
> inspected vehicles need to ever go to a ref? Or is the label basically
> the same thing as the sticker a BAR ref would provide (meaning as long
> as it passes tailpipe/rolling road a the next smog check it's fine)
>
> Here's a question then, do you think one could ever swing a deal with
> a lab for reduced pricing say if you bought contract testing for 10,
> 20, 50, or  X number vehicles?
>
> The lab near us capable of doing similar testing (for EPA, CS95, CARB)
> was around $2k a pop... do they also require shed testing on something
> as old as the vanagon? I've heard conflicting reports about it, some
> said yes, both hot and cold soaks, but others said no shed testing
> required.
>
> Jim Akiba
>
> On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 4:47 PM, Jeff <vw.doka@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Perhaps we're not talking about the same thing... my point is that any
> > engine conversion that meets California emissions standards can be
> certified
> > as California legal by the test lab.
> >
> > This is not for a kit, it is a single install in a single vehicle.  The
> next
> > time you do the same conversion, it would have to go to the lab for
> testing
> > and certification again.
> >
> > It is basically the same procedure that is performed on every vehicle
> that
> > is imported into California.  It doesn't matter what engine is in the
> > vehicle, only that it passes the lab test.
> >
> > If it passes the lab test, it's good to go...
> >
> > Obviously, this would get expensive, but it is absolutely true.  This is
> not
> > conjecture, it is what we do for a living.
> >
> > Jeff
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: jakiba@bostig.com [mailto:jakiba@bostig.com] On Behalf Of Jim
> Akiba
> > Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 1:37 PM
> > To: Jeff
> > Cc: vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com
> > Subject: Re: Was: Re: John Wessels Glori's --- Now: California Engine
> > Conversions
> >
> > It's still false.  The statement "Any "clean" engine conversion can be
> > certified as legal in California"  can only be true if it is also the
> > case that it is not possible to have a "clean" engine conversion and
> > have it declined for certification in CA. Since it is the case that
> > having a clean engine conversion *alone* is no guarantee to getting
> > the BAR sticker, the statement is false.
> >
> > I know what you mean, but you can't speak in universals about it,
> > that's the crux of the problem.
> >
> > Jim Akiba
> >
> > On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 2:36 PM, Jeff <vw.doka@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Jim,
> >>
> >> It is absolutely true.
> >>
> >> I think you are confusing my "certified as legal" as being the same as
> an
> >> EO.  That's not what I said.  My comment was that any clean engine
> >> conversion (not a kit) can be tested and labeled as meeting California
> >> emissions.  This is a "one off" test and is only good for that
> particular
> >> installation.
> >>
> >> Assumptions always cause confusion....
> >>
> >>
> >> Jeff
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
> Of
> >> Jim Akiba
> >> Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 11:02 AM
> >> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> >> Subject: Re: Was: Re: John Wessels Glori's --- Now: California Engine
> >> Conversions
> >>
> >> This is not true Jeff, I don't know where you got this impression. The
> >> CARB would not even prescribe which of the two types of lab testing
> >> needed to be done via the application process. Rose Castro told me
> >> personally that if the engine came from an OBDII vehicle they defer to
> >> the BAR and nothing can be done through CARB to obtain an EO. They
> >> will not even allow you to get to the point of submitting the lab
> >> results.  Show me an OBDII conversion that is legal in CA and you'll
> >> be onto something, but until then nothing has changed.
> >>
> >> Jim Akiba
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 1:45 PM, Jeff <vw.doka@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Any "clean" engine conversion can be certified as legal in
> California...
> >> IF
> >>> you are willing to pay for the testing.  Unfortunately, the testing
> adds
> >>> about $3k to the cost.
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>>
> >>> Jeff
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> Behalf
> > Of
> >>> Don Hanson
> >>> Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 9:12 AM
> >>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> >>> Subject: Re: John Wessels Glori's Import offering Zetec & Subie engine.
> >> Was:
> >>> now..ignore the small stuff..?
> >>>
> >>> I've been sort of following this thread.  Since I don't actually live
> in
> >>> California, I probably shouldn't chime in, but I do spend winter months
> >>> there and I've been around the Calif. beaurocracy some.  It's scary
> that
> >>> other states justify stuff by pointing at California, also.
> >>>
> >>>  I have some friends who have an engine conversion company for mostly
> >>> Porsches. They were forced out of California over to Las Vegas to do
> >>> business.  Renegade Products.  They supply conversions for putting Chev
> >> V8s
> >>> into 944s and 911s.  The owner even has an LT-1 Vette motor in his 914.
> (
> >>> ~500hp in a 2000 lb roller skate!)
> >>> They got so frustrated with the CARB, the DMV and all,  that they just
> >>> packed up and moved to Nevada and now do just fine out there.  Even
> > though
> >>> the conversions they sold tested much cleaner than the 80's-era turbo
> >>> Porsche motors they were replacing, they were not 'allowed' by
> Cali..  I
> >>> know many of their customers have their vehicles now registered in
> > Nevada,
> >>> also.   ...
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> h
>

--
Donna