BenT,

While I understand your response, your position is weakened by citing
typos.  Unnecessary.  Although Mike is incorrect (any signals or rules), he
did write 'apparently' and 'seem'.  I would disagree with your adjective
(irresponsible).  I would term it incorrect or Amerikun, given his entire
statement and the fact that he seemed to imply he didn't have first hand
experience.

I do see a rationale for driving autos differently than riding bikes or
walking because the potential for bodily harm is much greater.  This is
precisely why I advocate 'bike only' corridors in Portland, which BTW is a
very bike conscious city.  I can't speak for other cultures but Amerikuns,
as individuals, are slow to adopt *habits* which make traffic combinations
(bikes/autos/public transport) acceptably safe (unless they own bikes
themselves).  I suspect that would be the case for any human.  This is
evidence by the rapid change of perceptions of new bikers/motor bike riders
in mixed traffic.  But I digress.  And no, this 'type' of accident does NOT
happen anywhere.  It only happens in jurisdictions which use human signals.
Mike, I believe, was referring to traffic using human signals only.

I've no experience with SF drivers so cannot comment on them.  IINM, I did
not imply the accident was caused by the VW driver OR the human signals I
referred to in China.  In fact, I believe I implied they were better drivers
than we (u.S.).

I believe you misunderstood Mike in that he was not implying Chinese drove
autos thousands of years ago but that they haven't adopted traffic
rules/habits that are diff than their bike/ped rules/habits, was he not?

And, seems to me it's quite easy to agree on bipedal transport thousands of
years ago (in China) via art and lit.  Tho' I wish peeps would use that same
logic when thinking/arguing about the age of Earth!

Cheers!

On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 9:26 AM, BenT Syncro <syncro@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 3:15 AM, Mike <mbucchino@charter.net> wrote:
>
> >  Oh, those crazy divers in China.  This busy intersection doesn't appear
> to > have any traffic signals or rules! > >  They're apparently all new
> drivers there, and they seem to try to drive
> > cars the same way that they've walked or bicycled for the past several >
> thousand years..........
> >
> > http://www.break.com/index/scary-truck-rollover-destroys-small-car.html
> >
>
>
> What do "divers" have to do with busy intersections in China? You really
> should get out more. This type on accident can occur anywhere. Just turn
> your TV to the Spike channel on late
> afternoons. Sure there is a greater ratio of inexperienced vs. experienced
> drivers in China. But making an absolute statement they are "...apparently
> all new drivers
> there..." is irresponsible.
>
> The two postings that followed makes a good example. I am not saying they
> are inaccurate but the posters clearly locked on the idea of China rather
> the accident video. Do you think they
> would have written something totally different had you said something like
> "Those crazy drivers in San Francisco..."
>
> By the way, the bicycle has only been with us since circa the 18th century.
> So no, the Chinese  or anyone else for that matter could not have been doing
> this for '...the past several thousand years..."
> Hard to say how the Chinese walked thousands of years ago w/o having any
> first-hand accounts. I suspect they walked the same way as other people
> elsewhere in the world -- mostly on two legs.
>
>
> Regards,
>
> BenT
>

--
Neil2
'82 Diesel Westfalia (USS Tinosa)
'86 Vanagon/Westfalia Wannabe (SaVannah)
Nunquam Pendite Divendium