oh we're really in trouble now.
thank you for the information that H & R spring are not stiffer, just lower.

If you are totally convinced that spring rate has nothing to do with 'ride
and handling stiffness' .............
I don't even know where to start.
And some people............just have their mind made up about incorrect
things, and are not open-minded about learning anything new. Hope that
doesn't chacterize you.

and of course, it's the spring/shock combo that's really important.
thanks,
Scott

----- Original Message -----
From: "Raimund Feussner" <ray@v6bus.de>
To: "Scott Daniel - Turbovans" <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Cc: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:07 PM
Subject: Re: Purple springs from H&R

> Purple H+R are NOT stiffer.
> They are just lower.
>
> I had them installed about 8 years ago. They wore out a lot, 3 of 7 spring
> turns are "on block", so no more spring effect there.
>
> The stiffness is independent from the springs, it�s the shocks!
>
> I used the purple springs with stock shocks. Sucks...
> Stiffer shocks made the Van better in corners.
>
> Whether with or without new shocks, the purple springs don�t like short
> bumps. These really hurt!
>
> Raimund
>
>
>
> Am 17.12.2008 20:58, Scott Daniel - Turbovans schrieb:
>> Hi Mark, 'stiffer than stock' springs are definitely very desirable.
>> they considerably help handing as far as turn-in and corning ability go.
>> I kinda hate stockers for having just too low a spring rate for any
>> performance corning abilities on pavement.
>>
>> What I want is 'same ride height' just stiffer by 30 % or so.
>> I haven't heard of any of those for sale.........I get the impression
>> that
>> what you have is 'stiffer and lower'  which is not what I want.
>> but if you're selling that set .........maybe I'd be interested.
>>
>> I put Syncro.org springs, with Old Man Emu shocks, bigger brakes, and 15
>> inch wheels with Michelin  Agilles tires on an SVX syncro westy I built
>> for
>> a guy......
>> I have raced cars, I've raced off road in Baja, I've raced motorcycles,
>> and
>> have driven over a million miles in many kinds of cars.......so I have
>> 'some
>> experience's and I have to say, that syncro westy with that set up on it
>> handling fantastically on pavement.  Like I couldn't have asked for any
>> more
>> out of it.
>>  Running those same tires and wheels on my current 2WD vanagon I can say
>> some of that was those tires.........awesome pavement summer tire for a
>> vanagon ......205/65 R15 C ..........but I hate my stock-soft spring
>> rates -
>> thing still mushes out easily into hopeless understeer if you push it
>> hard
>> into a corner........
>> primarily due to  too soft spring rates.
>>  Bottom line is, you want something other than stock springs,
>> but what you want is 'taller and stiffer' ......which is what syncro.org
>> springs are for syncro's....
>> another well-known company makes their version,
>> and I have not tried Van Cafe 2WD springs......but I believe those are
>> taller and stiffer too, for 2WD.
>> Ideal to me for pavement is close to stock height........and about 30 %
>> stiffer, and  just guessing on that figure.
>> I don't want or like the 'slammed' look, like 'quite lowered' and I don't
>> need the '2 inches taller thing' either ..........personally, I just want
>> somewhat stiffer.
>>
>> ( my performance personal car, a turbo volvo sedan.........is almost
>> 'unreasonably' too stiff in the ride department..........but that car
>> NEVER
>> mushes out or lets you down in a corner.  It's brilliant that way, and
>> I'll
>> gladly live with a little stiffness to get handling prowess.   What tire
>> you
>> run matters a LOT  too. Stock on my volvo are H speed rated tires, which
>> are
>> very harsh riding, but 'T' speed rated tires are perfectly supple and
>> sweet
>> on it, and handling is still 'right there.' )
>>
>> And you gotta have 15 inch wheels on a vanagon too ( or 16's ) .......
>> 14's
>> can't really cut it at all, not for any well-developed properly
>> sorted-out
>> serious vanagon.
>> The difference on my personal 2WD vangon between any kind of 14 inch tire
>> I
>> could find, and 15 inch Michelin agilles tires is night and day, not even
>> comparable, the van is so much 'more' in every way with 15's and really
>> good
>> tires on it.   Let me know if you want to sell those springs you have, I
>> might be interested in them.
>> or trade for other vanagon or SUBARU-Vanagon parts.
>> Scott
>> www.turbovans.com
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Mark A Kippert" <vanagon@KIPPERT.COM>
>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 11:31 AM
>> Subject: Purple springs from H&R
>>
>>
>>> While crawling under my van cleaning the tranny to body ground I
>>> noticed that I had purple springs. They are on all 4 corners. I
>>> finally got around to checking them out further. They appear to by by
>>> H&R. I took some pictures and on the passenger side saw what I think
>>> is a model number (29 951 VA). My research indicates they lower the
>>> van 1.5 inches. I'm not sure I want my van lowered, I kinda like a
>>> taller ride.
>>>
>>> Does anybody have any experience with them? Are they something I want
>>> on my Vanagon. A previous owner must have wanted them but is it
>>> something I will find beneficial?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>> -Mark
>>>
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