I have had the crankshaft seal at the tranny/crankcase connection leak
twice, both times requiring removing the tranny and installing a new
seal. The first time was three weeks after a complete rebuild by a very
competent local engine re-builder who has rebuilt hundreds of Volkswagen
engines, including the WBX'r. It happens.

About 6-8 weeks ago, I had to have that seal replaced again - same
engine - now with 150,000 on it.  It happens.

I rebuilt a 6 cylinder horizontally opposed cylinder aircraft engine,
directed by the very best Aircraft Engine Mechanic I ever knew. The
front crankshaft seal by the propeller flange of the crankshaft leaked
in less than 10 hours of operating time. It happens.

I sent the propeller and governor off of my 1968 Cessna 210 to an FAA
Certified Repair station for a rebuild. Neither is a field repairable
appliance and to be leagal must be rebuilt by a certified overhaul shop.
, and require a certificates of compliance to be returned to service.
The governor  leaked almost from the get-go after re-installation. It
happens.

But in this case - I cheated a little bit. I didn't want to be grounded
for another week to ten days to wait for the round trip back to the
repair station and back. I knew the likely culprit - a $0.50 O-ring
right in the top of the thing. I cut the safety wire, removed the
cover, removed a little cap inside, tilted back the counter-weights,
replaced the O-ring, reassembled it and re-safetied  the top back on,
re-installed the thing and flew it several hundred hours without further
ado. It was going strong with no leaks when I sold it and  the new owner
flew it away.

John Rodgers
Clayartist and Moldmaker
88'GL VW Bus Driver
Chelsea, AL
Http://www.moldhaus.com

On 6/30/2010 5:26 PM, Ry wrote:
> Well that bracket isn't bolted to anything because .......? it's bolted in 8
> other places, mine doesn't budge a millimeter the way it is, I've seen other
> people leaving this bracket off.  no i won't jump off a cliff if they do
> though! :)
>
> Are you thinking it has an effect on my issue or are you just pointing out
> the obvious for me? :)
>
> I'm also familiar with the complete idiots guide from when I owned a 1967
> beetle.  I thought it was a good read, comical and whatnot with
> some philosophical insight into life.  Didn't know it would be very
> applicable to a 1991 Vanagon.  I should pick up another one just to have
> around, if for nothing more than the cover.
>
>
> peace,
> -Ry
>
> On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 5:09 PM, Karl Wolz<wolzphoto@q.com>  wrote:
>
>
>> It's been a while since I've had reason to look at my tranny/engine
>> interface, but your photo brings up a question.  Why is (I'm assuming) the
>> exhaust bracket not bolted onto something?
>>
>> Get a copy of John Muir's book, "How to keep your Volkswagen alive for the
>> complete idiot".  It lays down some simple rules for the use of the book,
>> one of which is, in all descriptions, front is front, like by the
>> headlights, back is back, like by the taillights.  I am not quoting, since
>> I
>> cannot lay my hands on my copy right now.
>>
>> I've had leaks from the front main seal before that we had a heck of a time
>> getting rid of.  Turns out there are two main seals listed for the
>> application; one is, IIRC, 12mm thick while the other is 10mm (I could
>> easily be wrong on these measurements, but they're close).  You'd think the
>> thicker one would work better, but at least in my case, the solution to the
>> oil leak was to go with the thinner one, which can be recessed lightly into
>> its home.  No more leaks.
>>
>> Karl Wolz
>>
>> |-----Original Message-----
>> |From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
>> Of
>> |Ry
>> |Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 2:16 PM
>> |To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>> |Subject: Re: Oil leak since rebuilt 2.1l installed
>> |
>> |yes, i meant to mention the smell test as well.  the mt-90 i used was
>> |rather
>> |red in color also.
>> |
>> |Will try the crankshaft jerk/pull when i get home after things cool off
>> and
>> |report back.
>> |
>> |
>> |-Ry
>> |
>> |
>> |On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 4:10 PM, Scott Daniel - Turbovans<
>> |scottdaniel@turbovans.com>  wrote:
>> |
>> |>   hi Ry,
>> |>  just for funzies...
>> |>  grab the crankshaft pulley and try to push it in and out........
>> ..engine
>> |>  off of course ( and no one sitting in the driver's seat either )
>> |>  checking for end-play.
>> |>  there shouldn't be any easily detectibible end-play.
>> |>
>> |>  not likely that it'll move excessively, but it's a simple test that by
>> |>  remote chance could reveal something.
>> |>
>> |>  usually you can tell gear oil from engine oil by smell.
>> |>  the Redline MT-90 gear oil I'm using lately seems engine oil colored,
>> |more
>> |>  or less.
>> |>
>> |>
>> |>  ----- Original Message -----
>> |>  *From:* Ry<rylincoln@gmail.com>
>> |>  *To:* Scott Daniel - Turbovans<scottdaniel@turbovans.com>
>> |>  *Cc:* vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com
>> |>  *Sent:* Wednesday, June 30, 2010 1:23 PM
>> |>  *Subject:* Re: Re: Oil leak since rebuilt 2.1l installed
>> |>
>> |>  Thanks for the free brain cycle time :)
>> |>
>> |>  The reason I *think *I know it's not transmission oil is color, i have
>> |>  that redline synthetic and that as you probably know, has a definitive
>> |color
>> |>  to it.
>> |>
>> |>  I'll drop the trans next time i have a 4 day weekend to spare and some
>> |>  spare parts.
>> |>
>> |>  flywheel was preinstalled, i certainly hope it was properly installed
>> but
>> |I
>> |>  should check it.  i've never done a rear main seal job.  I've done seals
>> |>  when changing wheel bearings.
>> |>
>> |>
>> |>  carry on,
>> |>
>> |>  -Ry
>> |>
>> |>  On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 2:46 PM, Scott Daniel - Turbovans<
>> |>  scottdaniel@turbovans.com>  wrote:
>> |>
>> |>>  hi,
>> |>>  it was clear you were talking about the engine-transmission junction
>> |area.
>> |>>
>> |>>  yeah, there shouldn't be a drop there with a fresh engine.
>> |>>  and if you're sure it's engine oil.. ..  Just because trans is rebuilt
>> |>>  that doesn't mean 'for sure' it can't leak some there .
>> |>>   In my brain I never think 'oh that's new, can't be that' ..
>> |>>  I think the opposite ...that was just worked on ....the problem could
>> be
>> |>>  there .
>> |>>  I always go for the most recent work when there's an issue ...I often
>> |find
>> |>>  'the issue' there.
>> |>>
>> |>>  things that come to mind if it's engine oil -
>> |>>  rear main oil seal of course.
>> |>>  anything to do with end play of the crankshaft and that whole end-play
>> |>>  shim/rear main seal area.
>> |>>
>> |>>  oh ...here's one..........I've seen this one ...no lock-tite on the
>> |>>  flywheel bolts ....oil will gradually migrate up the threads of the
>> |flywheel
>> |>>  bolts if there is not a sealant or lock-tite on the bolt threads.  They
>> |>>  should always bet lock-tited in of course.
>> |>>  there's an o-ring on the crankshaft side of the flywheel...that's gotta
>> |be
>> |>>  there.
>> |>>
>> |>>  anything to do with crankcase pressure and not venting/relieving
>> |pressure
>> |>>  properly.
>> |>>  Waterboxers seldom have that problem ...but the oil tower ...there are
>> |>>  moving parts in there...
>> |>>  spring and some other part ...if that was all clogged up , could be a
>> |>>  factor.
>> |>>
>> |>>  doubt it's the oil itself, but consider that....brand, grade, and
>> |>>  viscosity.
>> |>>
>> |>>  but if the engine is new ...
>> |>>  it sure shouldn't do that.  If it did that in a year say ...mabye ok,
>> |>>  but new.....shouldn't be an oil drop there.
>> |>>  it should be either ... a seal issue, or what the seal seals against
>> |>>  .....or breather/crankcase pressure issue. ...somewhere in there.  Even
>> |>>  excessive main bearing oil clearnce could cause it.  Or cheap rear main
>> |>>  seal. The good ones are all red, or have a red lip where they actually
>> |do
>> |>>  the sealing ...the all black ones are not so hot, but they should work
>> |find
>> |>>  for a while .
>> |>>   If it was mine, I'd be taking the trans or engine out to look at
>> things
>> |>>  very carefully, much as one hates to do that over one small drop.
>> |>>
>> |>>  Scott
>> |>>  www.turbovans.com
>> |>>
>> |>>
>> |>>
>> |>>  ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ry"<rylincoln@GMAIL.COM>
>> |>>  To:<vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>> |>>  Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 11:59 AM
>> |>>  Subject: Re: Oil leak since rebuilt 2.1l installed
>> |>>
>> |>>
>> |>>
>> |>>  when i say rear of engine i mean where it mates up with the
>> |transmission,
>> |>>>  oil pump is on the "front" of the engine. sorry for the confusion, I
>> |>>>  still
>> |>>>  think of the engine seperate from the van so i don't get confused on
>> |>>>  front
>> |>>>  and rear designation.
>> |>>>
>> |>>>  Definitely not transmission oil, i have a rebuilt trans too, replaced
>> |at
>> |>>>  same time as engine.
>> |>>>
>> |>>>  No oil on the engine lid, only on the bottom of the engine where
>> |>>>  transmission and engine meet at the center of the case.
>> |>>>
>> |>>>  I'm not calling out the rebuilder on the list, that would be poor
>> form,
>> |>>>  but
>> |>>>  I didn't rebuild it, was professional rebuild.
>> |>>>
>> |>>>  this is the area where it drips once or twice when stopped.
>> |>>>
>> |>>>
>> |
>> http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/3L4SAvf39FK2iLzL_frNBw?feat=directlink
>> |>>>
>> |>>>  -Ry
>> |>>>
>> |>>>
>> |>>>  On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 1:27 PM, Scott Daniel - Turbovans<
>> |>>>  scottdaniel@turbovans.com>  wrote:
>> |>>>
>> |>>>  'carry on' ...lol.
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>  make sure it's not transmission oil ...could be.
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>  if it is engine oil...
>> |>>>>  no, should not have a slow leak or any drips there.
>> |>>>>  I'd say the only acceptable level of leak there would be one drop of
>> |oil
>> |>>>>  sitting on the engine ..at the most ...and no drops on the ground ...
>> |>>>>  shouldn't have that with a new engine.
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>  ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ry"<rylincoln@GMAIL.COM>
>> |>>>>  To:<vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>> |>>>>  Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 9:59 AM
>> |>>>>  Subject: Oil leak since rebuilt 2.1l installed
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>   So, I'm not terribly worried about this but am interested in the
>> |>>>>  opinions
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>>  of
>> |>>>>>  the hive mind here.   I installed a rebuilt 2.1l engine ~3,500 miles
>> |>>>>>  ago.
>> |>>>>>  Pretty much since the beginning there has been a slow oil leak from
>> |the
>> |>>>>>  rear
>> |>>>>>  of the engine.  I assume it's the rear main seal(what else is back
>> |>>>>>  there?
>> |>>>>>  It's not enough to warrant needing to add oil between oil change
>> |>>>>>  intervals,
>> |>>>>>  there are maybe 1 or 2 drops of oil on the ground when parked for
>> |>>>>>  several
>> |>>>>>  hours.
>> |>>>>>
>> |>>>>>  Oh no woah as me, I know.... this is NOT a major problem, but I sure
>> |>>>>>  would
>> |>>>>>  like to have NO oil leaks, is this unreasonable?  Do many people
>> have
>> |>>>>>  little
>> |>>>>>  leaks they just ignore?
>> |>>>>>
>> |>>>>>  I reckon I'll just live with it for now.  I have an oil pressure
>> |gauge
>> |>>>>>  and
>> |>>>>>  oil temp gauge along with an external oil cooler so I should get
>> |warned
>> |>>>>>  quickly of any lubrication troubles.
>> |>>>>>
>> |>>>>>  carry on,
>> |>>>>>  -Ry
>> |>>>>>
>> |>>>>>
>> |>>>>
>> |>>>>
>> |>>
>> |>
>>
>>
>>
>
>