I understand the whole mark up deal. As far as cost of keeping inventory etc. If a shop can get parts for less than retail (they should), it seems the margin for mark-up is built in.

BenT

Sent from my spare tire

On Sep 4, 2010, at 2:43 PM, Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM> wrote:

> here is all the work, responsibility and effort a shop goes through when it
> supplies a part for a car repair job -
> 
> first is price and quality of the part - you have to know it's going to be
> adequate or better.
> Availability is a factor - keeping regularly needed parts on the shelf ties
> up money, and takes up space. so some of that sure, but preferred not to
> have too many scheckels tied up there. .
> Availability also affects quality sometimes - there may be a part that's
> more readily available, but costs more or is of lower quality, and from the
> 'good supplier' takes a day or two.
> 
> then there's actually putting the part on the car, which is 'really' ...most
> people don't realize this, but just installing the part on the car or van is
> almost *incidental*  to the entire proceeds.  Just screwing it on is a very
> tiny part of the whole job picture .....
> There's  the entire 'is this the part the car needs ? is it a good one ? has
> the customer got the $ for it ? is it really going to fix The Issue, etc.
> All that./
> 
> then there is ....fairly minor thing ..there's getting rid of the packaging
> the part came in.
> then there is managing cash flow to be able to pay the supplier in the first
> ten days of next month for the parts the shop bought this month.
> then there is documenting and carrying the thing on your invoices and tax
> records for years ongoing.
> 
> I've had people work for me. I've had a guy say he was doing 'all the work'
> by installing the parts on the car.
> He has 'no idea.'
> I might work four hard hours before I can say 'here, put this water pump on
> this car' ...
> that's making sure that's what that car needs, that it's all of what that
> car needs, that the customer is a fair reasonable person, that their check
> is good, or they have the money etc.
> 
> I identified 23 ...23 full steps in the Car Repair Process, from the time
> someone calls and says ' My car does X and I need it fixed'
> until the job is done, paid for , and gone.  And stays fixed of course.
> 
> 23 steps, and the installation of the part is only ONE of those 23 steps.
> 
> I'll install parts people ask me to install.
> But I explain that I am responsible for the correct installation of the
> part, not the result.
> Say the car wanders all over the road ..
> if they ask me to install their shocks....I put them on right, and it is
> whatever it is , how it comes out.
> If they want the actual problem fixed..
> then they have me diagnose and come up with a plan, then we do that , and
> they get the result they were really after.
> and of course ..
> if a shop installs a customer supplied part, and the part is faulty ..
> they don't owe removing and installing the next one for free.
> If they provided the part, of course they are obligated to get a good one on
> the car. And if any shop ever installs a faulty part, then wants to charge
> to replace it ...
> that's the end of that customer for that shop of course. 'People just want
> to get what they paid for.'
> Heck..
> they don't even really mind if it's expensive sometimes...they just want to
> *get what they paid for.*
> 
> anyway ..
> if you really look deep into it ..
> there's a lot that goes into getting it all  to work out the vast majority
> of the time for each repair job.
> a LOT actually !
> the part  itself, or the parts themselves, are only a tiny part of the whole
> picture actually.
> A very important one for sure though !
> and really 'car repair' is pretty stressful overall...dealing with the whole
> thing, and the people and cars day in and day out ..and sometimes employees
> too ....
> I don't envy most car repair shops and owner's.
> 
> these days it's very much about the quality of the parts we can get.
> I've had to learn which parts supplier knows to get a victor rintz red
> lipped diesel engine rear main seal, for example.
> it's getting harder and harder it seems to consistently get really well made
> parts ..
> even companies traditionally supplying german parts ..
> now have diesel head bolts in the same box ...but it says made in Taiwan on
> it ..
> and funny thing ...these days 'made in Taiwan's is not that bad a thing
> actually.  those are the good inexpensive parts often, not that I see many
> parts from there.
> I see them from Israel, Turkey sometimes, and I  just got 185 R14 C tires
> made in Thailand.
> 
> 'parts' are a whole world unto themselves of course,
> as we all know too well !
> Scott
> www.turbovans.com
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dave Mcneely" <mcneely4@COX.NET>
> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> Sent: Saturday, September 04, 2010 11:07 AM
> Subject: Re: How much should parts cost?
> 
> 
>> Bruce, the most important thing is to have a good relationship with a
>> shop, so that you trust the pricing.  I agree that the shop should make a
>> profit on its services and goods on the customer's behalf.  I find that
>> independent shops are the best ones to deal with.
>> 
>> I also understand what Daryl said about the parts paying the bills (and
>> also paying the shop owner -- who must be paid).  But, that said, I am
>> lucky to have access to a shop whose owner is willing for me to buy the
>> parts myself, and he installs them at his standard labor rate.  He must be
>> able to pay his bills and himself (one man shop) without the parts markup.
>> What I do is ask him what he will have to charge me for the part.  If it
>> is less than I would pay elsewhere (sometimes it is), I buy it from him.
>> If it is more, and the part I can get is of equal or better quality, I may
>> buy it myself and take it to him.  But I may not.  My guy, likes most who
>> will accommodate in this way will include labor in the parts warranty if
>> he supplies the part, but not if I supply it, so that is a consideration,
>> especially if installing rebuilt parts such as an alternator.
>> 
>> The trouble with the situation you mention, is that you don't really know
>> what the shop is paying for the parts or what the markup is, and so you
>> distrust the situation.  MOST shops do not overcharge relative to their
>> cost, but they may not shop for the best price for the best part, either.
>> Usually, they have a supplier they deal with on a regular basis, with a
>> credit line, and they are reluctant to look elsewhere for a part, if that
>> supplier has the part.  Even if you find a supplier that lists dealer
>> (wholesale) cost in their catalog or web page, that does not mean that
>> your mechanic pays that price for that part from the supplier he/she uses.
>> The shop may be paying more or less than that, even from that same
>> supplier, or from another one.  Generally, a shop will charge you the same
>> price the shop's supplier would charge you (the retail price) if you
>> bought the part yourself from that supplier, so in that regard, it is a
>> wash.
>> 
>> Another consideration for me is that the shop is also providing the
>> service of sourcing and acquiring the part, and not just the part itself.
>> It is like concierge service at a hotel.  Since I am unlikely to need
>> parts on a regular basis, I have to do some research and legwork when I do
>> need a part.  The shop has all that down.
>> 
>> A straightforward conversation with the shop owner might help, either your
>> bottom line or if not that, your understanding.
>> 
>> David
>> 
>> ---- Daryl Christensen <daryl@AATRANSAXLE.COM> wrote:
>>> 30% minimum is the lowest markup to stay in business. Some are up to 50%
>>> or
>>> more these days. Always said to me that the labor pays the help and the
>>> parts pays the bills.
>>> 
>>> Daryl of AA Transaxle
>>> 425-788-4070
>>> "On the cutting edge of Old technology"
>>> 86 Syncro Westy with a Zetec in the trunk
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
>>> Of
>>> Bruce Todd
>>> Sent: Saturday, September 04, 2010 10:12 AM
>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>> Subject: How much should parts cost?
>>> 
>>> This question goes out to all the working vanagon mechanics & shops out
>>> there...what would a reasonable and fair mark-up be on parts purchased by
>>> the shop for the client?  I think I'm getting gouged on a few things but
>>> before I make a call to discuss I thought I would ask the list.
>>> 
>>> I do understand that parts are a profit item for a shop...but what is
>>> typical?
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> 
>>> Bruce
>> 
>> --
>> David McNeely