| Subject: | I'm getting the FAS Gen 5 and info |
| From: | David Bjorkman |
| Date: | Thu, 17 May 2012 09:15:41 -0500 |
<DIV style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 24px"><DIV><FONT size=2>As a matter of fact, a lister is getting that installed, and it's ME. And it's NOT a Tiico engine. Jon and his crew have been in development on this engine for close to 3 years now. The problems with the Tiico were why they went this route. VW Germany is supplying the engine, after Jon explained what he wanted from them. FWIK, that took some doing.</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face="">I am picking mine up today or on Saturday. Although it is the Beta, they have had it in my camper for almost 2 years and have run it through all possible climate changes, and have computer tested it (computer connected while driving around as well as extensive bench and dyno) for every variable they can come up with. Jon is a really nice guy, but a perfectionist and can be to the point of bring a PITA, but when done, there are no problems. These conversions are available.</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face="">The vast majority of parts are off the shelf. It was made this way so noone is left with an inability to get parts in some out of the way place (ever been there?). </FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face="">When I did my search for a reliable transplant, I found other power plants had issues or they would leave me scratching my head over where I would take my bus if I had issues I couldn't deal with. Somehow bringing my Vanagon to a Ford dealership just didn't seem right (sorry Bostig). I am just a fair mechanic, am really up on theory, but don't want to be left hanging with the wife and kids camping a K or 2 from home and all my tools.</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face="">This is the route I went. Having watched pretty closely with FAS on this project and having worked through other conversions, I can be confident in recommending this power plant as the best way to go. See other notes on this thread for more info on this engine or contact Chris at Foreign Auto. <A class=parsedEmailparsedEmail href="mailto:chris@foreignautosupply.com" target=_blank>chris@foreignautosupply.com</A><BR>When I contacted Jon about this post and kit availability he sent me this reply.</FONT></DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face="">"you can mention that the components are almost entirely off of the shelf current production car parts excluding all the ones we have designed---(no diesel items at all though... except of course on the diesel specific conversions.) The engine to transmission/ matting, hanging, and fuel/induction/ exhaust portions of the kit were completely designed, prototyped, and fabricated in house as you already know. Our goal was to have as long as a run longevity wise as possible by using current production run engines making these something a dealership or VW specialty shop could easily maintain. <DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>We plan to sell the entire engine and "turn-key" kit in 5 versions: </FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>1. A traditional throttle cable design version for both std. and automatics ( Our Betas have reported an average of 24-26 mpg on highway driving) </FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>2. The same kit as #1 but "throttle by wire" and special hybrid Bosch fuel injection package...which as you'll see with yours... I feel unmatched in regards to it's smoothness under travel and load...probably the smoothest van I've ever been in from 45-85 mph </FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial> 3. A turbo charged version of #2 complete with intercooler and all plumbing (not that it is really all that necessary except for the fact we are still guys!) </FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>4. The "pumpe duse" Turbo diesel complete kit</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>5. Kits #1-3 in a version that fits '73 - '79 aircooled Bay window busses with a uniquely designed in house radiator package mid-belly style.</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial> **We will also be selling just an install component kit version which is just the kit minus the engines as well...something we changed our mind recently on that we had initially never planned to do. We will also be selling a version of our unique hydraulic cradle bar mounting system package that we designed for the old Tiico/ ABA in-line conversions (fantastic upgrade) as well as for DIY's AAZ, 1Z or AHU, ALH diesel conversions."</FONT></DIV> </FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face="">Hope I didn't go over the line, but I am enthusiatic.</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face=""></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT size=2 face="">Dave B.</FONT></DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV style="MARGIN: 5px 0px; BORDER-TOP: #bcbcbc 1px solid"></DIV><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: arial; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 12px">On 05/15/12, <SPAN>neil n<musomuso@GMAIL.COM></SPAN> wrote:</SPAN><DIV> </DIV><DIV style="FONT-FAMILY: arial; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 12px">I think the Gen. 5 is still in the R&D stage (isn't a lister here getting<BR>that installed? Some info there maybe?)<BR><BR>Does FAS offer the ABA 2.0 + 1.8 eight valve head + Digifant combo?<BR>Installed correctly, this can be a reliable swap and has been done before.<BR><BR>The following are musings from an amateur and fan of the VW inline swap.<BR>I'm not saying "yay" or "nay" and not touting this swap over any other.<BR>What one chooses is a personal preference thing. I do run a swap email list<BR>but am only in it to help others. I'm a musician by trade.<BR><BR>The Gen 5 is another beast. It looks like they're using the 2.0 short block<BR>(block + head) as-is but with serious fabrication for the intake manifold,<BR>engine carriers, etc. Click on the image to see a photo album of their<BR>work. From the POV of an amateur who has done a little design and<BR>fabrication, I really like what they're doing and enjoy seeing the work.<BR>But I'm a relatively narrow audience in that regard. IMO, assuming the<BR>exhaust system remains crack free, and the carriers hold up (why wouldn't<BR>they?) that will be a nice swap. Some or all of the parts they're<BR>fabricating appear to be done in house so one would need to get those from<BR>them. But..... all things being equal, items like engine carriers, intake<BR>manifold, brackets for coolant bottles etc. should last a long time.<BR><BR>Although I'm a fan of the VW inline swap, since this engine is just<BR>emerging, like any product in that stage, I'd wait and see. But that's just<BR>me.<BR><BR>You could ask if FAS does the 2.0 ABA block + 1.8 8V head swap + Digifant +<BR>diesel Vanagon parts. (or equal) When done right, (as with any swap) it's a<BR>good combo and has a good track record.<BR><BR>Neil.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>On Tue, May 15, 2012 at 9:24 AM, Jon Durham <<A class=parsedEmailparsedEmailparsedEmailparsedEmail href="mailto:jon_durham@knology.net" target=_blank>jon_durham@knology.net</A>> wrote:<BR><BR>> What is the opinion on these engines?<BR>><BR>> <A class=parsedLink href="http://foreignautosupply.com/" target=_blank>http://foreignautosupply.com/</A><BR>><BR>><BR>> On 5/15/2012 11:11 AM, Stuart MacMillan wrote:<BR>><BR>>> I'm investigating this too.<BR>>><BR>>> The problem with your question is that given an infinite amount of time<BR>>> and<BR>>> money you can do just about anything. Here is my personal favorite, but<BR>>> it's<BR>>> not so good for a camper:<BR>>> <A class=parsedLink href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?**v=iD2tYiyX_sE&feature=channel&**list=UL" target=_blank>http://www.youtube.com/watch?**v=iD2tYiyX_sE&feature=channel&**list=UL</A><http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iD2tYiyX_sE&feature=channel&list=UL><BR>>><BR>>> In my mind there are only two options for a normal person. The Bostig kit<BR>>> (<A class=parsedLink href="http://www.bostig.com/" target=_blank>www.bostig.com</A>) , which is the only turnkey kit available and uses all<BR>>> new<BR>>> parts. You can get a brand new Zetec crate engine for a grand plus $150<BR>>> shipping:<BR>>> <A class=parsedLink href="http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-**FORD-FOCUS-ZETEC-2-0-LITER-**" target=_blank>http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-**FORD-FOCUS-ZETEC-2-0-LITER-**</A><BR>>> 16V-DOHC-ENGINE-2000-<<A class=parsedLink href="http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-FORD-FOCUS-ZETEC-2-0-LITER-16V-DOHC-ENGINE-2000-" target=_blank>http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-FORD-FOCUS-ZETEC-2-0-LITER-16V-DOHC-ENGINE-2000-</A>><BR>>> 2004-/290711119875?pt=Motors_**Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&**<BR>>> hash=item43afbba803<BR>>> &vxp=mtr#ht_500wt_1023 or a used one for $250. Every bit of this<BR>>> install<BR>>> is new, with the exception of the power steering pump which they recommend<BR>>> getting used. Bostig support seems to be good. You also have the benefit<BR>>> of<BR>>> an OBD2 diagnostic system, and an engine that is cheaper to replace than<BR>>> it<BR>>> is to fix. (Think about that for a minute. You could keep a spare in the<BR>>> garage!)<BR>>><BR>>> The other well documented swap is the Subaru 1995-96 2.2 SOHC engine.<BR>>> Kennedy Engineered Products (<A class=parsedLink href="http://www.kenneyadyenginc.**com/" target=_blank>http://www.kenneYadyenginc.**com</A><http://www.kenneYadyenginc.com>)<BR>>> has an adapter<BR>>> kit, but you must get all the ancillary parts as well as the engine from a<BR>>> donor car and there is a lot of fabricating and fiddling. If you follow<BR>>> the<BR>>> Subaru Vanagon Yahoo! list like I have you will see there appears to be<BR>>> endless fiddling with most Subaru installs. You also need to fabricate a<BR>>> custom wire loom from the stock loom (several hours work alone). It's<BR>>> getting hard to find low mileage engines now (trust me and I don't think<BR>>> 100k is low mileage).<BR>>> These engines have the early OBD1, which is at least of some use.<BR>>><BR>>> They both have their advantages and disadvantages, but none are as bad as<BR>>> the waterboxer. It was a flawed plan right from the beginning to convert<BR>>> an<BR>>> air cooled engine into a water cooled engine simply by casting water<BR>>> jackets<BR>>> on the case and adding new heads. The longevity of this engine is in<BR>>> inverse proportion to the power it puts out as well with the 1.9 being the<BR>>> longest lived by far, maybe by as much as a factor of 2 over the 2.1.<BR>>><BR>>> Plan on being your own mechanic with any conversion, unless you can find a<BR>>> pro who will install and service it. If you do it yourself, you will<BR>>> probably be happier with the install simply because you will have<BR>>> invested a<BR>>> lot of time in making it work well.<BR>>><BR>>> There are shops all over the country that will install one or the other<BR>>> for<BR>>> you, and the total cost for a pro install for either is about the same<BR>>> here<BR>>> (Seattle). I expect you could do the Subaru yourself cheaper than the<BR>>> Bostig, but time is money too!<BR>>><BR>>> Good luck!<BR>>><BR>>> Stuart<BR>>> '85 Westy, time constrained and leaning towards the Bostig<BR>>><BR>>> -----Original Message-----<BR>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [<A class=parsedLinkparsedEmailparsedEmailparsedEmail href="mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.**com" target=_blank>mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.**com</A><vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>]<BR>>> On Behalf Of<BR>>> Jon Durham<BR>>> Sent: Monday, May 14, 2012 4:38 PM<BR>>> To: <A class=parsedEmailparsedEmailparsedEmailparsedEmail href="mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM" target=_blank>vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM</A><BR>>> Subject: Which Engine To Install and by Whom<BR>>><BR>>> As best I can tell, to get more horses, there is a 2.1 WB, a 2.2 WB, a<BR>>> Subaru, and a Ford engine to replace my 1.9L engine in my 85 Vanagon.<BR>>><BR>>> I would like to get opinions on the engines and recommendations as to who<BR>>> is<BR>>> good for installing the engines.<BR>>><BR>>> Cheers<BR>>> --<BR>>> "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."<BR>>> Anatole France<BR>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>> --<BR>> "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains<BR>> unawakened." Anatole France<BR>><BR><BR><BR><BR>--<BR>Neil n<BR><BR>65 kb image Myford Ready For Assembly <A class=parsedLink href="http://tinyurl.com/64sx4rp" target=_blank>http://tinyurl.com/64sx4rp</A><BR><BR>'88 Slate Blue Westy to be named.<BR><BR>'81 VanaJetta 2.0 "Jaco" <A class=parsedLink href="http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/" target=_blank>http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/</A><BR><BR>Vanagon VAG Gas I4/VR Swap Google Group:<BR><BR><A class=parsedLink href="http://groups.google.com/group/vanagons-with-vw-inline-4-cylinder-gas-engines" target=_blank>http://groups.google.com/group/vanagons-with-vw-inline-4-cylinder-gas-engines</A><BR></DIV></DIV>
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