Scott ~ you may not have looked far enough

        From Dictionary.com

en·train2    [en-treyn]
verb (used with object)

1. Chemistry . (of a substance, as a vapor) to carry along (a  
dissimilar substance, as drops of liquid) during a given process, as  
evaporation or distillation.

2. (of a liquid) to trap (bubbles).

3. Meteorology . to transfer (air) into an organized air current from  
the surrounding atmosphere ( opposed to detrain).

On 15 Sep , 2012, at 12:16 AM, Scott Daniel - Turbovans wrote:

> Hi Dennis,
> I know you said you are not a writer.
> 'entrained' means to put aboard a train  - dictionary.com.
>
> yes..entrapped air in fresh water/coolant.
>
> lol...'has went' is properly expressed as 'has gone' ..as in 'the
> trucking industry has gone that way' for example.
>
> hmmm.       I suppose adding coolant puts entrapped air into a cooling
> system...
> and that 'could' lead to more corrosion.
> So tell me...
> if a system uses coolant slightly, for no readily apparent reason ..
> like the majority of water-cooled vanagons do ..
> what is one supposed to do .........not add coolant ?
>
> what I find is ............that air gradually works it's way out ..
> I find that when a cooling system is opened up ..
> it takes up to 6 warm-up cool-down cycles for things to stabilize.
> and ..
> if one just tops up the pressure bottle at each cool down cycle after
> opening the cooling system ..do that several times ...top up there if
> there's much of an air space for the first few warm-cool cycles
> .......that works just great.
>
> about oxygen causing more corrosion ..
> few people seem to recognize the cleverness and effectiveness of this
> method..
> and I have been having excellent results with minimal or No cooling
> system corrosion by adding to my coolant mixture a little bit of water
> soluble oil ( machinist's cutting oil ) as a water pump lubricant and
> rust inhibitor.
> That flat works Baby !   I've only been doing it about 20 years..
> and it wasn't even my idea, I read it somewhere, a professional
> automotive trade magazine perhaps.
>
> If you are going to entrain, please tell us where you are going !
> scott
> www.turbovans.com
>
>
> On 9/14/2012 8:40 PM, Dennis Haynes wrote:
>> Fresh water/coolant contains some amount of entrained air. After  
>> filling the
>> heating of the coolant will drive this air out and at some point it  
>> will
>> leave the system and be replaced with coolant in a properly operating
>> system. Anyone experienced with large boiler/industrial heating  
>> systems
>> knows about this and the use of air/vapor separators. It becomes more
>> obvious in the Vanagon since there is so much capacity compared to  
>> the size
>> of the expansion/overflow tanks.
>>
>> This entrained air/oxygen is why systems that regularly have  
>> coolant added
>> end up with so much internal corrosion. Every time you add coolant  
>> water,
>> you add fresh oxygen. This is also one of the advantages of long life
>> coolants and why the auto/truck industry has went this way. New  
>> vehicle, get
>> the air/oxygen out of the coolant and let it be. In 5 years/100,000  
>> miles it
>> will need a water pump, hose, heater core or maybe a head gasket  
>> anyway.
>>
>> Don't believe this works! Ask anyone on this list that owns a house  
>> with
>> baseboard heat when the last was they changed the plain water in  
>> their
>> boilers and baseboards?
>>
>> Dennis
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On  
>> Behalf Of
>> Scott Daniel - Turbovans
>> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 2:56 PM
>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>> Subject: Re: No Coolant in Small Tank Behind License Plate
>>
>> one suggestion..
>> fill your license plate bottle with whatever coolant mixture you use.
>>
>> another is ...in my world, it takes up to 4 warm-up-cool down  
>> cycles for air
>> to get out, coolant to get in ..
>> I 'know' proper bleeding should make that not be so ..
>> but it is anyway, in my world.
>>
>> I would never give someone a van back after touching the cooling  
>> system in
>> any way until I had seen it go through several warm-up cool down  
>> cycles.
>> Period.
>>
>> re the smell...
>> it's always a good idea to smell in the left upper vent every time  
>> you park
>> the van, as any smells...like coolant, raw gas, or burning oil will  
>> be
>> readily apparent there.
>> At least LOOK around in the engine compartment..
>> there is always some 'residual burn off' affect...
>> coolant spilled on exhaust or the engine ....it shouldn't take 'too  
>> long'
>> though for that effect to go away.
>>
>> When you have a vanagon worked on ...
>> it's not like 'oh, it's fine now, I don't have to think about it' ..
>> No ...it's the other way around...
>> "It was just worked on ..nothing counts until I see several  
>> successful
>> sorties go by ..
>> AND I've looked at the area worked on ...for tools left there, for  
>> loose
>> things not tightened ...etc. etc. etc. "
>>
>> you know the old saying ....sometimes there isn't time to do it  
>> really right
>> the first time..
>> but there's always time to do it right later.
>>
>> top up your license plate bottle to the full level line ...
>> look around the engine and under the van for any drips .
>> and really ....
>> the smart thing to do is check the cooling system for a few days  
>> after
>> having it opened up or coolant changed.
>> I always tell people..
>> it is normal that it may pull coolant out of the license plate  
>> bottle at
>> first ..for a few warm-up cool down cycles..
>> and guess  what else..
>> what the shop explains to the customer to empower them to operate  
>> their van
>> successfully ..
>> is MORE IMPORTANT than the work itself !
>> in my world anyway.
>> < after all..........someone pays, they expect to get what they  
>> paid for.
>> There is no excuse for any shop to not produce that.>
>>
>> Scott
>> www.turbovans.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9/14/2012 9:59 AM, Donna Skarloken wrote:
>>> Happy Friday - I just picked up my 87 Syncro last night from a
>>> reputable garage where I had the coolant system flushed and  
>>> replaced.
>>> It was late and dark so I didn't check the coolant before I left the
>>> garage and had to drive about 25 miles home.  All seemed well,  
>>> except
>>> when I parked and shut off the motor I could smell coolant VERY  
>>> strongly.
>>>
>>> This morning I was all set to go to work but decided to take a  
>>> look at
>>> the coolant level behind the license plate because that strong  
>>> coolant
>>> smell bothered me and I was unable to check it the night before.  I
>>> discover NO coolant in the tank behind the license plate.  I had  
>>> to go
>>> to work so could not do a further inspection, and it was still  
>>> dark out.
>>>
>>> Any suggestions?
>>>
>>> I have not had any problem with low level or no coolant in this  
>>> bottle
>>> prior to taking it to the shop to have the coolant flushed.  (I  
>>> left a
>>> voicemail for the mechanic; he is quite busy so I am not sure what
>>> time today that he will get back to me and of course I am stressed  
>>> out
>>> about this since I spent a whole bunch of money at that shop this
>>> week.  The shop does specialize in Vanagons, otherwise I would not  
>>> have
>> taken there).
>>> Thanks, and have a great Friday and weekend.
>>>
>>> Donna, 87 Syncro
>>>