*"Lowering engine RPM at a given speed means increased torque and load.
That means more stress, heat, and over time broken parts."*

YUP.. Dennis is right... very similar to going up hill in 4th...

On Tue, Nov 18, 2014 at 5:42 PM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> Which 14" BFG? The floatation tire does not quite follow the same
> guidelines as passenger tires. No rating for traction or tread wear etc.
> While it has the ability to get you going in snow or on soft surfaces there
> is little there for directional control or performance handling at speed.
> That snow flake symbol is a sign of winter driving performance on the road.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
> Of Ralph Meyermann
> Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2014 8:08 AM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Re: Suspension for Off Roading
>
> I went 215/75/15 bfg all terrain for the snowflake that the 14" version
> doesn't have. Dunno why the 14" doesn't ?
>
> Velma 82 1.9L AAZ TD Westy
> On Nov 18, 2014 12:13 AM, "Dennis Haynes" <d23haynes57@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > The 27X8.5 tire is a "floatation" size designation. It is really about
> > 26.5" diameter. If you put one side by side with a 215/70-14 the
> > height is almost identical. Due to the stiff construction of the type
> > of tire the load capacity is different than other tires due to
> > heating. It needs to be at 50 psi to carry 1515 pounds as rated. That
> > is also its maximum inflation pressure. If you have the alloy or 6'
> > steel wheels you can go to a
> > 225/70-14 which gets you to a 98 load index. Very had to find but
> > there are tires up to 225/75-14 or even 205/80-14. The 205/80 would be
> > a load range C or D truck tire.
> >
> > If going for wheels I would suggest going right for 16" Much more
> > choice of tires with adequate load capacities. 215/65-16 works well
> > for those looking for a tad more height and is still reasonable for
> > the gearing and brakes.
> > As for gear changes and stuff keep in mind the transmission was based
> > off a vehicle much lighter and lower powered. Any change including
> > just larger tires has an adverse effect on transmission life. Lowering
> > engine RPM at a given speed means increased torque and load. That
> > means more stress, heat, and over time broken parts.
> >
> > Dennis
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> > Behalf Of Dan N
> > Sent: Monday, November 17, 2014 3:15 PM
> > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > Subject: Re: Suspension for Off Roading
> >
> > unless there's another tire that I don't know... but with 27x8.5R14
> > it's the largest diameter you can have with 14" rim...
> >
> > next step up would be 215/75R15 - the 215/75R15 here is 27.7x8.5R15
> > equivalent so you have .7" more for the price 15" rims (x4)
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 17, 2014 at 10:51 AM, Eric Wunrow <VW@ericwunrow.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Thank You.
> > >
> > > My fronts are the 195/75 size, though I do like the 27x8.5 profile
> > > better… partly because I want as much ground clearance as possible
> > > (we've done some pretty wicked roads already, not a problem after 30
> > > years backroading with street cars!). Going to 16" wheels would
> > > help, but unless I put in more horsepower, it seems prudent to not
> > > change gear ratios and make it harder to pull the bigger wheels.
> > > Maybe this
> > isn't as bad as I fear...
> > >
> > > Some have suggested the Too Tall springs, but not sure if that's a
> > > good look with small wheels. Hence my asking all of you, and the
> > > help is greatly appreciated!
> > >
> > >  Eric
> > >  Eric Wunrow Pictures
> > >  85 S Union Blvd, #Q123
> > >  Lakewood, CO 80228
> > >
> > >  303. 988. 8717
> > >  VW@EricWunrow.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Nov 17, 2014, at 9:49 AM, mcneely4@cox.net wrote:
> > >
> > > > Eric, not only is a 14" wheel with high profile tires an option,
> > > > it was
> > > original equipment on most Vanagons.  On my '91, I currently run
> 195R14.
> > > That is actually a little taller profile than 80 -- maybe it is 83.
> > > Original equipment was 185R14, which would also be about 83 profile.
> > > This gives maximum sidewall height, and so in driving back country
> > > (quite feasible with the 2WD version of the Vanagon, unless one
> > > encounters deep mud or sand, or very steep going) both the tires and
> > > the rims are less susceptible to damage than either would be with
> > > lower
> > profile tires on.
> > > Air is a pretty good cushion.  mcneely
> > > >
> > > > ---- Eric Wunrow <VW@ERICWUNROW.COM> wrote:
> > > >> Thanks, Jeff, that certainly makes sense. My comment about wheel
> > > strength was not about tire sidewall height, just wheel height vs.
> > > strength in absorbing the shocks off off-road travel.
> > > >>
> > > >> Am I wrong that a taller wheel can aborb more shock than a
> > > >> shorter
> > > wheel? If so, is a 14" wheel with higher-profile tires an option?
> > > >>
> > > >> Thanks!
> > > >>
> > > >> Eric
> > > >> Eric Wunrow Pictures
> > > >> 85 S Union Blvd, #Q123
> > > >> Lakewood, CO 80228
> > > >>
> > > >> 303. 988. 8717
> > > >> VW@EricWunrow.com
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> On Nov 16, 2014, at 3:08 PM, Jeff <vw.doka@GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> Actually, it works the other way around.  After 20+ years of off
> > > >>> road
> > > racing (Baja 500 - 1000, etc.), I can assure you that the higher
> > > profile of the tire helps protect the rim from damage.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Just look at the rim/tire combinations that are run by serious
> > > >>> off
> > > roaders.  Off course, they also use bead locks...
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Cheers,
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Jeff
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> -----Original Message-----
> > > >>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> > > Behalf Of Eric Wunrow
> > > >>> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2014 1:09 PM
> > > >>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > > >>> Subject: Re: Suspension for Off Roading
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Good advice. I have the alloy 14-inchers from VW and do wonder
> > > >>> how
> > > tough they are  that said, I've hammered them quite a lot and
> > > they're still straight.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> I believe that the larger the wheel is, the more one can punish
> > > >>> them
> > > without failure, and I suspect this is true of the alloys as well.
> > > Not sure which way I'll go when upping to 16"...
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Eric
> > > >>> Eric Wunrow Pictures
> > > >>> 85 S Union Blvd, #Q123
> > > >>> Lakewood, CO 80228
> > > >>>
> > > >>> 303. 988. 8717
> > > >>> VW@EricWunrow.com
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On Nov 16, 2014, at 8:15 AM, Don Hanson <dhanson928@GMAIL.COM>
> > wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>> Another consideration when working on your off road
> > > suitability....Alloy
> > > >>>> wheels are more prone to damage than steel ones.   Alloys will
> > > fracture or
> > > >>>> fail when you hit the rim into a pothole or smoosh a huge
> > > >>>> boulder with a low air tire....Steelies, if they do get damaged
> > > >>>> off road, they can be bent back often times....or at least
> > > >>>> enough to get the bead to seat for the tire, enabling you to
> > > >>>> keep moving.  I have twice bent steel
> > > rims in Baja
> > > >>>> and broken an alloy aftermarket one.   One of the steelies I bent,
> > we
> > > were
> > > >>>> almost 60 miles from pavement and there was nothing around.   We
> > > >>>> straightened the rim with a rock and aired it up using our
> > > >>>> bicycle pump, with gasoline and a match to seat the bead....In
> > > >>>> Baja you may sit for days on end until another vehicle comes
> > > >>>> along...often finding an appropriate rim may involve long
> > > >>>> distances to help....I keep my
> > > rims in steel now.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 7:43 AM, Dan N <dn92610@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>> Yes I do deflate the tires when I do off road - usually I take
> > > >>>>> out 10psi and 15psi on sand - in any case I leave a minimum
> > > >>>>> 20psi. As Dennis mentioned there's a risk of damage to tires
> > > >>>>> specially on the side wall if the road has a lot sharp rocks
> > > >>>>> such as the one from Ubehe Crater to the Race Track in Death
> > > >>>>> Valley. I always carry a 12V
> > > air pump, off road or not.
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 7:26 AM, Dennis Haynes
> > > >>>>> <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
> > > >>>>> wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Off roaders will air down the tires to improve traction and
> > > >>>>>> reduce
> > > >>>>> sinking
> > > >>>>>> on soft dirt, mud, and sand. As the pressure is lowered the
> > > >>>>>> contact patch increases. They will often air down low enough
> > > >>>>>> that the sidewalls can
> > > >>>>> also
> > > >>>>>> provide a floatation effect, 12-16psi is common. The down
> > > >>>>>> side of this is an increased chance of rolling the bead off
> > > >>>>>> the rim and having a tire completely air out and hitting any
> > > >>>>>> type of sharp object can damage a tire internally. Note this
> > > >>>>>> approach is for low
> > > speed operation.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> You didn't say what tire you are using, size or type, If
> > > >>>>>> using a regular passenger tire you reach full capacity at ~35
> psi.
> > > >>>>>> Above that you are
> > > >>>>> going
> > > >>>>>> for handling or reduced rolling resistance.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Dennis
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> > > >>>>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com]
> > > >>>>>> On Behalf Of Stan Shapiro
> > > >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2014 10:14 AM
> > > >>>>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > > >>>>>> Subject: Re: Suspension for Off Roading
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Another question on suspension.   I have a 90 Westy, 16 in
> wheels,
> > > >>>>>> Michelin tires, and Bilstein shocks from GoWesty.    It is
> > terrible
> > > on
> > > >>>>>> washboard roads.     I notice the 4 wheelers let air out of
> their
> > > tires
> > > >>>>>> before going off road.    Does anyone have any experience in
> > > letting a
> > > >>>>>> small amount of air out for a washboard road??    If so, how
> much
> > > do you
> > > >>>>>> let out?   Do you carry a 12 volt compressor to refill?
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Thanks
> > > >>>>>> Stan
> > > >>>>>> Idaho
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> > > >>>>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com]
> > > >>>>>> On Behalf Of Chris S.
> > > >>>>>> Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2014 2:58 PM
> > > >>>>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > > >>>>>> Subject: Re: Suspension for Off Roading
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> See Burley Motorsports' custom upper control arms that
> > > >>>>>> eliminate the finicky bushings. Also, for a good off road
> > > >>>>>> ride you may consider progressive long travel springs. I have
> > > >>>>>> Schwenk springs on my Syncro and they are wonderful.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Chris.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Wyslane z iPhone'a
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Dnia Nov 15, 2014 o godz. 14:47 Eric Wunrow
> > > >>>>>> <VW@ERICWUNROW.COM>
> > > >>>>>> napisal(a):
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Hello:
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> I thought about posting this on the Samba but you all seem a
> > > >>>>>>> bit more
> > > >>>>>> civil  and helpful.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> We are traveling full-time in a 1984 Westy we bought just
> > > >>>>>>> months before
> > > >>>>>> leaving, and are about to end Month 16. Challenging, yes  and
> > > >>>>>> perhaps
> > > >>>>> equal
> > > >>>>>> parts commendable and committable. But we are in for the long
> > haul.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> I have had four alignments done in 12K miles. At first I
> > > >>>>>>> thought the
> > > >>>>>> mechanics weren't torquing the right upper control arm
> > > >>>>>> enough, as it
> > > >>>>> keeps
> > > >>>>>> coming loose and knocking toe way out  last time it was over
> > > >>>>>> AN INCH out, and now a few hundred miles later, it's out
> > > >>>>>> again and baking our new BFG ATs. Ugh.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> The easiest solution seems to be replacing the control arm
> > > >>>>>>> bolts, as I
> > > >>>>>> do not think Loctite will solve it in the proper way. But, if
> > > >>>>>> the arms
> > > >>>>> need
> > > >>>>>> to come off anyway, and possibly new bushings are needed as
> > > >>>>>> well, what
> > > >>>>> are
> > > >>>>>> my options for upgrading the suspension for constant dirt
> > > >>>>>> travel? I saw a gray panel Synchro at Buses by the Bridge in
> > > >>>>>> January with Fox shocks and
> > > >>>>> it
> > > >>>>>> looked like a great solution. I am willing to trade highway
> > > >>>>>> comfort for
> > > >>>>> off
> > > >>>>>> road softness before parts start flying off at will.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> We hope to keep our Bus forever, and though we are short of
> > > >>>>>>> funds I do
> > > >>>>>> not necessarily want a quick fix. We have to rely on this
> > > >>>>>> Thing (Ahem, sorry, Bus) for a long time and may take it
> > > >>>>>> around the
> > globe.
> > > >>>>>> So
> > > >>>>> anything I
> > > >>>>>> can do for the long-term good is of prime interest, and
> > > >>>>>> getting to remote places is partly why we live in it.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Also, if you know of anyone in So. Cal. or near Yuma capable
> > > >>>>>>> of this
> > > >>>>>> work (where we're wintering), I'm all ears. I found a
> > > >>>>>> cooperative tire store owner in Pahrump who owns a few
> > > >>>>>> Vanagons, but have yet to ask if
> > > >>>>> such
> > > >>>>>> an upgrade is within his realm.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Thanks in Advance,
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Eric
> > > >>>>>>> Eric Wunrow Pictures
> > > >>>>>>> 85 S Union Blvd, #Q123
> > > >>>>>>> Lakewood, CO 80228
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> 303. 988. 8717
> > > >>>>>>> VW@EricWunrow.com
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > David McNeely
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>