On 15 Jun , 2018, at 11:48 AM, Karl wrote:

> I've never in 35 years of working on these seen a need for an additional relay,

        Well in 39Yrs of working on these I have seen the Improvement that an 

added relay can provide so Perhaps You just haven't been working on these

Long Enough ~

> so we'll have to agree to disagree here.

        While Agreeing to Disagree is Ok to apply to a discussion of Subjective

Opinions, this is not that ~ The addition of a Relay to the 50Circ' can indeed

provide a more efficient path for power to the Starter Solenoid & Eliminate

unnecessary degradation of the Igni'Switch & Connections & Wires in the OEM

50Circ' ~ 

        I suppose if You feel that this is about whether OK is sufficient vs Better

then We can agree to disagree ~

> If all connections are clean and strong

        That is the Big If in these Old Beasts ~ Certainly making sure All Conn's

& Wires are Clean & Strong in Our Vans would be a proper thing to do ~

> there is no need for bandaids.

        The Relay is not a Bandaid, 

It Is The way the Circuit Should Have Been Done In The 1st Place ~

> The required current to activate the starter is quite small.

        So far what I am finding is that Initial Current to extend the Solenoid can

be in the 25-35Amp range & then it will drop to 8-12Amps during the remainder

of the Cranking to Start ~ While Relays appear to only have Needs in MilliAmps ~

        Still looking ~

> Wires don't 'get tired'.

        Perhaps "tired" was the incorrect word to use ~

"There is a wearout mechanism in metal called electromigration. The failure
typically relates to high current (electrons) moving metal atoms resulting in
voids (missing metal atoms or a hole in the metal line). This failure typically
appears close to the contact area and not in the middle of a wire."

        Corrosion also causes a wire to be less efficient & I suspect We've All seen

that ~ 

                                                        ORR ~ DeanB
> 
> 
> 
> On 6/15/2018 9:13 AM, OlRivrRat wrote:
>> On 15 Jun , 2018, at 1:11 AM, Karl Mullendore wrote:
>> 
>>> Easy fix - get rid of the unnecessary relay - as was done. The TDI starter
>>> doesn't need this added complexity.
>> 
>>      I Strongly Disagree with this ~ Anything that can be done to Lighten the Load
>> 
>> on Our Van's Old & Tired Wires & Switches & Connectors is a Good Thing ~ Especially
>> 
>> in Instrument Cluster & FuseBlock area ~
>> 
>>      The TDI Starters Efficiency is a Big Help but without a Start Relay the Current
>> 
>> required to Hold the Starter Solenoid is Still having to pass through the Entire Length
>> 
>> of the 50Circuit, All its Connect's & the Igni'Switch < That is what is Unnecessary ~
>> 
>>                                                      ORR ~ DeanB
>>