& If Wires Don't Get "Tired" what causes Incandescent Bulbs 

to Burn Out & Resistors to Open ~

On 15 Jun , 2018, at 9:07 PM, David Beierl wrote:

> I mostly agree with Karl here.  If the starter cranks as well (or poorly)
> from the key as it does by jumpering the 50 terminal at the starter, then
> there is nothing to be gained in terms of the starter working.  If it
> doesn't, then it's arguably as easy to fix the poor connection as to
> install a starter relay.  I say connection because wires don't get tired,
> but crimps and connections do when left out in the weather the way VAG did.
> 
> That said, the relay does reduce the stress on ignition switch contacts.
> The solenoid is an inductive load, so it arcs more at the switch contacts
> than a similar resistive load.  The switches I've taken apart (no Kostal
> ones yet) show pitting and arc burns on the the center contact at the 30
> terminal, which seems to do most of the actual make-and-break switching.  I
> tried to look at one just now to verify my recollection, but too many
> pieces were missing for me to make sense of it.  It's kind of a horror
> inside -- the key-inserted switch complicates things considerably.
> 
> Yrs,
> d
> 
> On Fri, Jun 15, 2018 at 1:48 PM, Karl <tdiguru@westyventures.com> wrote:
> 
>> I've never in 35 years of working on these seen a need for an additional
>> relay, so we'll have to agree to disagree here. If all connections are
>> clean and strong there is no need for bandaids. The required current to
>> activate the starter is quite small. Wires don't 'get tired'.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 6/15/2018 9:13 AM, OlRivrRat wrote:
>> 
>>> On 15 Jun , 2018, at 1:11 AM, Karl Mullendore wrote:
>>> 
>>> Easy fix - get rid of the unnecessary relay - as was done. The TDI starter
>>>> doesn't need this added complexity.
>>>> 
>>> 
>>>      I Strongly Disagree with this ~ Anything that can be done to
>>> Lighten the Load
>>> 
>>> on Our Van's Old & Tired Wires & Switches & Connectors is a Good Thing ~
>>> Especially
>>> 
>>> in Instrument Cluster & FuseBlock area ~
>>> 
>>>      The TDI Starters Efficiency is a Big Help but without a Start Relay
>>> the Current
>>> 
>>> required to Hold the Starter Solenoid is Still having to pass through the
>>> Entire Length
>>> 
>>> of the 50Circuit, All its Connect's & the Igni'Switch < That is what is
>>> Unnecessary ~
>>> 
>>>                                                      ORR ~ DeanB
>>> 
>>>