> >VW's thinking of putting a different engine in the Eurovan?  The Eurovan
> >is the new Vanagon.
> 
> Not even close!

It most certainly is.  I think the T3 style is going still in South 
Africa but only there.

>   Just like the Golf is effectively the new Beetle.
> >The Jetta is the new Super Beetle.
> 
> Again, nope.

You say so.  Beetle "WAS" the main sedan in the small car category.  Super 
was a way to make it carry a bit more.(suspension change to give more 
trunk room).  And now lets see.  The Golf "IS" the main sedan (hatchback 
rather) in the small car category and the Jetta is a way to make it carry 
a bit more (adding a trunk).

Okay the old air cooled stuff had a different personality.  But please 
rejoin reality.  Air cooled is obsolete based on many newer regulations.  
I miss the old beetle as well, but it ain't coming back.  Rear 
engine/rear drive is better than front engine/rear drive in many 
respects.  But front engine/front drive is the current state of the art 
for most applications.  Thats life.

> >Why would VW bring back an obsolete vehicle?
> 
> I don't think the Vanagon's obsolete by any standards.  It's just VW is
> tring to compete, very poorly, with the Big three Mini van's.  Front wheel
> drives the big thing. Even in Europe. But with VW's base prices about 5K
> more than the others why would anyone buy a VW.  I can buy a caravan for
> about 18K, with big HP V6 and lots of extra's. I'm just to loyal to VW to
> buy into the Caravan market. New VW's look to much like every other car on
> the road.  Besides, the Beetle design was old in the 1950's but they kept
> on making them, and still do in Mexico and Brazil, until 1979. Just because
> somethings old doesn't mean you throw it away. The Concept 1 is a 'rebirth'
> of the beetle with refinements.  The Vanagon was the last,best, refinement
> of the original Microbus. Eurovans are just tryin' to keep up with the
> Jone's.

The Eurovan does not compete with mini-vans any more than the Vanagon 
did.  These are both truck style approximately full sized vans.  Chrysler 
mini-van is nice for a station wagon.  Not a van.  Its called 'mini' for 
a reason.  Eurovan is not in that classification.  The Sharan was not 
created to reaplce the T4/Eurovan.  It was created to compete with the 
Mini-vans.  Compare the EV/T4 with Ram Vans or Econoline vans.  The MV is 
more like the Conversion vans than any mini-van anything.

> I'm also told that back in '83 VW was almost ready to installed a modified
> In-line 4 into the Vanagon,this would have been the smartest thing they
> could have done, but somehow ended up with the patents and rights the Scats
> watercooled flat-4 design. The person that told me this said that the new
> Vanagon would be a US only  Car, like the concept 1.  Thanks again.  That
> was my 2 cents.  Take care.

Ain't likely gonna be a new vanagon in the US.  It would be a really dumb 
thing to do - unless they import it from South Africa they'd have to 
spend millions to recreate an obsolete van that wasn't selling very well 
anymore.  You're as likely to see the Mexican vans imported probably.  

Like it or not thats the way the world is going.  T4 is a very successful 
vehicle in Europe (based on info I've read - not been there).  It 
replaces the T3 that was also very successful but hit its limits.  Its 
done.  Over. Run out of steam.  No longer practical.  Too expensive.  
Some folks talk about the price problem.  VWs have a disadvantage in 
being imported from Europe.  T4 is better than any other van/truck in its 
class.  T4 is better in most regards than the T3.  The T3 is better than 
the T2 as well.  I admit I want an old T1 split windshield but in pure 
technical engineering it is not as good as the later generations.  Bummer 
maybe but thats just the way it is.

Okay in some situations the older vans have niches they fill better than 
newer ones.  The older T1's have engine cost advantages over the T2 with 
the type 4 engine.  But the type 4 engine is "better" just not cost 
effective based on the sheer number of type 1 engines out there.  If they 
were equally common you can bet everyone would be swapping in the type 4 
engine into older cars.

I've heard T1 in stock mode is better at bouncing along off road than later 
vans (non-syncro that is) but that was probably due to being designed 
when roads weren't as good and that was more important.  If that is your 
niche cool.  But realize it is a niche.  Don't expect VW to be able to 
turn back the clock and make the world different again.

Sorry if some don't agree.

bill and diane killian
zen and the art of ferrets